Ranks, Testing, etc...

At the suggestion of someone in the Kuk Sool forum, I am bringing some questions out to the general area for discussion. I can't find a thread on this, so please forgive me if this has been covered recently.

I would like to discuss ranks, coloured belts (or other outward sign of rank), and testing.

Many styles have all three. Some styles have none. I've seen at least one style that had ranks but no outward signs of the rank at all. Some more traditional Aikido dojos have only white and black belts.

What is your school's procedure or policy on rankings, tests, and belts. Do you like that approach? Why or why not? Are the requirements for each rank clearly known? How long after a test do you wait until you find if you've passed? If no tests, how are promotions handled?

I can relate two different approaches, based on the two places where I studied formally.

Wah Lum Preying Mantis:

Spoiler

We had ranks but no outward signs of the ranks, and no tests except to become an instructor. Everyone wore a black sash. The levels were not really even discussed until you were close to being an instructor, even though the list of requirements for every level up to instructor were clearly posted in the kwoon.

Wing Chun:

Spoiler

We have seven ranks - no sash = beginner, then we have white, yellow, green, brown, red, and black sash, with a test for each. We don't have intermediate ranks (stripes) or anything like that. I am not sure what the requirements are for each as this information is not clearly posted. I have been told that when the sifu thinks you're ready to advance, he'll tell you that you need to prepare for a test. I've not seen a test at my new kwoon, so I don't know what's involved.

 

I like the local BJJ belt rank system. You get ranked when a black belt thinks you should be ranked.
The ceremony consists of the rankee rolling 30 minutes straight with a fresh opponent every minute. Then you run a gauntlet where people whip you with their belts.

It's suitably weird.

 

I'll agree with the "weird" part. That is rather... ummm... interesting.

 

Technically we have four ranks internally

1) Apprentice
2) Phase 1 Instructor
3) Full Instructor
4) Senior Instructor

Each individual club is free to rank/grade according to how they see fit. Some use belts, some don't. Technically JKD has no belts so it is usually for the internal club reference/motivation only. With that said the way the belt system has evolved over the years it is useful as an indicator for ability to those outside a club.

When I am asked I simply say "Full Instructor". If they need to label me with a grade I hold Dan grades elsewhere. Significantly I would probably be around a 5th Dan now had I stayed on the belt wagon. I stopped worrying about belts long ago

 

Belts aren't incredibly important at my school either, you just get the same as what Hannibal pointed out.

Belts don't really matter to me at all, just getting better. When I was younger, I was like "I WANT THE BLACK BELT".

But yeah, I am interested in how long a black belt in Aikido would take?

 

Minimum for grades at mine is about every six months. Yeah i love it because its not too short gives lots of time to learn stuff and its not too long so people arent stuck waiting long time for tests. Requirements are on our website. You only wait a few minutes after the test and they tell you if you passed or not. Its a good system. I like it.

 

I also want to point out that in BJJ, You are likely to get your first coloured belt somewhere between 1 and a half to 2 years. Belts after that take longer ^^

 

Kuk Sool Won Belts and Ranks

Kuk Sool Won has the following colored belts:

Huin Tti

Huin Tti and Stripe

No-Ran Tti

No-Ran Tti and Stripe

Cheong Tti

Cheong Tti and Stripe

Hong Tti

Hong Tti and Stripe

Ja Tti

Ja Tti and Stripe

Dan Bo Nim

Dan Bo Nim 2 Stripes

Dan Bo Nim 3 Stripes

Dan Bo Nim 4 Stripes

Dan Bo Nim 5 Stripes

Dan Bo Nim 6 Stripes

Dan Bo Nim 7 Stripes

Jo Kyo Nim and Kyo Sa Nim

Pu Sa Bum Nim and Up

Requirements for each rank are the same in any KSW dojang across the world and can be found here: http://www.kuksoolwon.com/site/about-kuk-sool-won/testing-requirement-chart
We have standardized uniforms as well, with under black belt students wearing an all Black Dobok.

Black belts can wear either the gold fringed black belt uniform or instructors can wear an all black version.


We wear black Dobok because "Black Uniforms were worn by the ancient Korean Royal Court Soldiers, and in Eastern culture, black is considered to be pure and good." ( http://www.kuksoolwon.com/site/about-kuk-sool-won/WKSAFAQ#22 )

We have formal uniforms called General's Uniform that black belts wear at demos, promotions and other occasions as needed. they have different color's based on rank.





Promotions for under black belts are handled at the school under the discretion of the Instructor/School owner and formal Black belt testing and promotion is done under the supervision of a visiting/local master and the grandmaster. There are typically 3 tests before a candidate is promoted to black belt.

I like the system we have in place, I know that my rank is good in any other WKSA School anywhere else in the world and that every other student out there wearing my same belt will have taken the same tests and learned the same techniques as I have.

 

That sounds a bit like MCMAP, where anyone who has earned a belt can teach to the level below them anything they have learnt, and rank the student upto the belt just below them

 

white
brown
black
Red

Similar to trad judo but some differences
i think its good because white means you're still learning.
brown indicates competency to a high degree on all levels
Black should be that you understand techniques and can transmit them effectively - black = brown + the ability to teach
Red means you brought something to the art no one else has - in BJJ that would be like delariva working on the position dramatically. no so much the founder, just an innovator

i think testing should be skill based so that you can prove can can show techniques as well as survive and use them on people at the same grade, lower and above.t

 

It's been a long time since I've been involved in an established promotional framework. Started in taekwondo, which is pretty clearly laid out. Got to the belt right before black belt (brown with a black stripe in our school, though I think it's usually red with a black stripe elsewhere). Then switched to eskrima.

In Doce Pares eskrima (with the Patalinghug family; "Cacoy" lineage), there was also an established belt system. Promotion was regular and easily anticipated. No surprises. Hard work, but no surprises.

After I got my black belt there, I started gravitating more and more toward "backyard training groups" in more informal settings (clubs, parks, etc.) Haven't been involved in a proper promotional system since. So I started martial arts around 1983. And I have one brown belt in taekwondo and one black belt (first degree) in eskrima to show for it.

Everything else is, as the song goes, "my own meandering experience." That has good and bad implications, honestly.


Stuart

 

All my CMA undertakings were under instructors who followed the "traditional" method of CMA ranking.

Which is to say,none.Just junior and senior students-(relative to each other)-and instructor level practitioners. A tradition which I followed in my own years of teaching. No outward insignia of level, no grade testing. I do prefer it this way,not unlike a boxing or wrestling gym.

 

I will explain our ranking system ... but I wanna make the belts on paint first. So I'll edit this post and add in the info later

Tbe

~Lea

 

Our studio is part of the Korean Musul Hapkido Association, but our belt system isn't regulated by them. We use rotating curriculum, so there isn't set material linked to each belt. The curriculum changes every two months in "testing cycles"; at the end of each "testing cycle", there is a promotion test where all belts (except white - they have their own, easier curriculum) are tested on this testing cycle's curriculum, and everyone who passes receives the next highest belt. Obviously, though, they expect the higher ranks to perform the motions/techniques better than the lower ranks.

Here's our belt system thingy:





































* if this belt for whatever reason makes you upset please read below



And obviously, black belts keep going up with various dans ... blah blah blah. Each degree of black belt has a different uniform too. Our color belts wear a plain black uniform, 1st dan is black with a white x pattern, 2nd is white with a black x pattern, and 3rd is black with a red x pattern. (Beyond that, I don't know )

*I know the camo belt has a really, really bad rep, but ours is a tad different than most. The camo belt is a really intense pre-black belt test (that some even say they thought was harder than the actual black belt). I thought I'd be mortified to wear it (b/c of it's bad reputation), but after working so hard to earn it, I actually became kind of proud of it

 

Camo belts = Good for being an invisible ninjer.

 

If you mean the Marine Corps Martial Arts Program, no. You still need to attend an instructor course.

 

My particular organization (a Kyokushin offshoot) has white, yellow, blue, green, brown, and black. No stripes or other trappings. Typically it takes quite a while to get a shodan in Kyokushin (I've heard many times that 10 years is average), and belt tests can be very physically demanding.

 

$$$$$$$$$$$$$!!!!!!

It didn't use to be that way,that started taking off in the 90s,along w/the two year BB (= purple belt)

10 years? Wasn't that way in the 60s in Oyama's org.