I've read the "fancy kicks" thread and a few of the posts there made me think about this. There are people who mentioned that they must stretch before attempting any type of "high" kicks and there are those who say they can do the head shots without any stretching. After practicing MA for awhile and really working on my flexibility, I'd have to say I fall into the second category. However....For those of you who hit the weights really hard, how do you handle the three or four days after legs day where you can barely walk, sitting down is painful and each movement is agony? My TKD training overlaps my weight training so naturally I have to deal with it (although painfully), but a lot of times I have to wonder what it would be like trying to face down a real opponent on the streets a day after doing 5 sets of squats with 450 pounds. I'm sure adrenalin would take over and everything would be cool, but I'm not willing to head to one of the seedier sides of town to experiment. Do any of you know any methods for relieving this tightness, pain, etc. so you can be more productive/effective in your training immediately following some serious weight training?
Immediately following a workout you shouldn't feel sore, but a rejuvenated good feeling. If you feel sore the next day you've more than likely pushed yourself way too hard or used muscles you normally don't use or haven't trained that particular area (such as the legs) for awhile. To minimize your soreness you should warm up before any weight training and cool down stretch after weight training (this will increase flexibility and move some of the waste products (lactic acid) out of the muscles to ensure less soreness in the days to follow. Most importantly, to prevent pain or extreme soreness, you MUSTuse proper form. Not feeling sore doesn't mean you didn't work out hard. There are times when I work out very hard and I do not feel sore.
Yeah, those are good points kickchick, and I try to get a really good stretch after working out (esp. legs). Usually, right after the weights it's time for practice anyway so I get the stretch there. I also work really hard to use correct form. I agree, if correct form isn't executed, a person can cause serious damage (and I have in the past on other body parts). I hit the legs once every week, to be sure to give them a solid 7 days of recovery time before hitting them again, so it's not a matter of not hitting them often. I think more of the issue is the fact that almost every other week I try to add more weight to the lifts I'm doing so there's never any "adaptability" time for the muscle so (hopefully) I can keep them in a semi-constant state of hypertrophy. However, back to your points - yep, I always feel rejuvenated right after working out (I love the "high" associated with a really good workout), it's always the days following where I'm stiff. I will try what you've mentioned - maybe I'm not doing enough of a warm-up before-hand or enough of a cool-down stretch afterwards. Thanks very much for your help, kickchick. You sound very knowledgeable. By the way, sorry I didn't post this in the Q & A section - didn't see that til after I'd already posted (newbie ignorance). P.S. - thanks for the help yesterday about running and "belly breathing". I did a jog/wind sprint session last night for 2 miles and using your method didn't get a side stitch once. Thanks!
sacrifice. do you want bodybuilders legs or kickboxers legs? you cant work at having both at the same time.they contradict one another.being stiff and sore is a good thing for a bodybuilder and it feels good to them as well.makes them feel that they've accomplished something and attained a new level in muscle development.this is all good if you are quitting martial arts and embarking on a bodybuilding carear.but..... if you want maximum snap,power and fighting stamina you cant train your martial arts legs like a bodybuilders.it's like a boxer mixing in heavy bench pressing to become a better puncher.and as any informative practitioner of boxing knows(heavy bag trainee or pro)your punching will not improve from heavy bench pressing.it will on the contrary,slow it down to rather turtlish proportions. when you squat hard and heavy or blast your pecs and triceps with big bench presses you shorten your tendons and ligaments, thus leading to much less abundance of punching and kicking ability potential. it has to be completely one or the other.if you want to mix in resistance training in the form of squats,do them for endurance only.use maybe half of your bodyweight and go for huge reps.you will not get crippled up sore legs the next day from this approach.you will build stamina this way which will resemble the type you get from jogging and cycling. bigger and overly musclebound legs do not make you a more powerfull kicker.training in kicking itself does and staying flexible and keeping the tendons and ligaments lengthy does all of that for maximum kick speed and power.
it's like a boxer mixing in heavy bench pressing to become a better puncher.and as any informative practitioner of boxing knows(heavy bag trainee or pro)your punching will not improve from heavy bench pressing.it will on the contrary,slow it down to rather turtlish proportions. Try telling that to Evander Hollyfield!
-Good point Bon, Evander was trained for years by 8x Mr. Olympia Lee Haney who put him on a bodybuilder's routine. I fairly regularly squat 600lbs for 10 reps and will at my most masochistic times squat 500 for 20 reps. I have NEVER seen any loss of flexability or speed. Quite the contrary, it has always improved these qualities. There are many well-meaning people who spread the old myths and will quote the pseudo-science that abounds regarding weight training/bodybuilding. I have been both a national-level competitor in powerlifting and bodybuilding (back in the late 1980's when they were doing the drug testing) and can do fullsplits cold(front and Chinese). As a kicker, I have placed in open forms at both NASKA and NBL world tour events and a member of the West Coast Demo Team. If I can do it, anybody can. As far as muscle soreness goes, besides what's already been stated, stretch between sets. This also expands the fascia layer while the muscle is pumped and can help inrease muscle size (since the fascia layer is not restricting the muscle). Both Michael Yesis and John Parrillo are experts and authors who have done a lot of research into restoration techniques that are very helpful. Also Bill Phillips of MUSCLE MEDIA and BODY FOR LIFE is very good at analyzing the most up to date research and putting it into an easily assimilated form for those who don't have the time to search through the research.
Movado: Sorry bud but I've never heard such a pile of hogwash talked about lifting heavy weights. Endurance training IS important yes -and is best done for legs with bodyweight squats and high reps. But we're talking strength training here not endurance training - you need both. Exhibit A: A martial artist who squats heavy AND does endurance training - and has been know to kick reasonably well
Have to agree with Yoda Sorry no pic included but how could I compare to the Adonis before me? I partake in what could be called a strength/power programme of weight training. For my size, 5'7" I weigh in at just under 13st 7lbs and that weight can be attributed to a pair of large thighs developed through HEAVY leg work. Yes, I feel pain for several days afterwards and yes I do stretch between sets. The latest medical research states that stretching has no effect on DOMS (delayed on-set muscle soreness). Stretching should always be incorporated in a workout BUT heavy weight training (for whatever bodypart) causes muscle tearing. This is what it does. Your body then responds to this and with a combination of correct nutrition and rest grows stronger (repairing the damage caused) so that next time you workout it can suffer less damage. This pain can be achieved by heavy sets or endurance sets. A proper set of 15 or 20 reps on a 'lighter' weight (where the last rep is THE LAST REP you can manage) stresses your muscles just the same. It merely affects a different muscle fibre type. Train properly, and hurt. As regards to the comments about sluggishness then I can only dream about the speed and power of my kicks if I didn't do heavy leg work. I must tell my training partner how lucky they are next time they complain about how hard I hit the pads or my opponent that the roundhouse kick I just did to go through their thighs was weak compared to what it could be. Perhaps I should give up the weights, maybe only then I could realise my full potential.
