QIGONG. Qi means energy and it isn't a metaphor.

Discussion in 'Other Styles' started by David Silver, Mar 1, 2021.

  1. David Silver

    David Silver Member

    Hi! Lets argue! Just kidding, I mean, discuss.
    You have to understand, I have been talking about the topic of Qi for decades, and realized long ago that WOW, is this a misunderstood topic that causes lo-o-ots of opinions. For instance, in the 90s, I was involved in explaining Qi /Chi on wikipedia, only to be DELETED and argued relentlessly with by total nonsensical skeptics with no counter point, only brazen disagreement. I'd like to think that in 2021 we have all caught up a bit on this topic, but I've seen a few misunderstandings in some threads...

    Those who wish to discuss qi defined as breath, or steam, or whatever, please read the article at the end of the introduction, in which my teacher Yang, Jwing-Ming explains the epistemology of the word.

    SO, shall we?
    The Chinese word Qi means energy. It is commonly used to discuss all forms of energy, in everyday life, in physics, and in martial arts. In Japanese it translated as Ki, as in Rei Ki (spiritual energy).

    The Chinese word Qigong (chi • kung) can be translated as “energy practice” or “energy cultivation”. Qigong is the ancient art of building the body’s Qi (energy) to a higher level and circulating it throughout the body for rejuvenation and health. Some Qigong is practiced sitting or standing still, while other Qigong can be a kind of moving meditation. This gentle exercise is a highly effective way to reduce stress, increase energy, enhance healing, and generally improve your quality of life.

    Gong is short for Gong Fu (effort/time), any discipline which takes practice to develop skill is Kung Fu. Over time you increase the quantity of your qi, and improve the quality of your circulation.

    Qigong is a way of life which teaches a practitioner how to maintain and improve his/her health and vitality through the cultivation of internal energy, or Qi. Qigong consists of exercises, breathing, massage, meditation, and lifestyle choices, such as proper nutrition and a healthy sleep schedule. Qigong practitioners strive to get the body to function in a balanced manner, and in harmony with nature.

    Similar to yoga, Qigong can stimulate the entire body deeply with low-impact movement and develop a stronger mind/body connection. The slow, relaxed movements are widely recognized for their health benefits, such as boosting your immune response, strengthening the internal organs, muscles, joints, and bones, and developing abundant energy. A qigong session makes one feel strong, centered, and happy. We stimulate the circulation of "happy" neurochemistry, without consuming or burning much, as in more aggressive exercises.

    In 2021, I think everyone has been exposed to this body of mind/body research since the 1970s which clearly demonstrates that the YOUR MIND CONTROLS YOUR IMMUNE SYSTEM.

    For most people, the first and foremost benefit of Qigong lies in helping to relieve or prevent chronic health problems. Recent studies have proven Qigong to be effective in helping people with insomnia, stress-related disorders, depression, back pain, arthritis, high blood pressure, and problems with the immune system, cardiovascular system, respiratory system, bioelectric* circulatory system, lymphatic system, and digestive system.

    Stop: how's your breathing right now? Are you inhaling for 5 or 6 seconds and exhaling peacefully in a calm, quiet rhythm?

    The relaxed, deep breathing during Qigong slowly works to increase lung capacity and increase the air intake into the bloodstream, which improves the function of every one of the trillions of cells in the body. What else are we inhaling all day long? IONS. We are made of energy, breathing energy, and manifesting energy in our thoughts and movements.

    Your mind is burning energy as you read and think right now. Your fingers will utilize energy to compose a thoughtful reply. Every thought, movement, and moment you are manifesting your energy; not only the mundane metabolic energy of life, but your higher spiritual energy, whether you're paying attention to it or not.

    As you progress in the training, Qigong can lead to deep meditative states, and can raise up your spirit, or morale. Regular practice can lead to the development of heightened awareness, both mentally and physically. Studies on the effects of total-body awareness have shown that being in this state produces a higher number of NK (natural killer) cells, which eliminate pathogens from the body. As a spiritual discipline, qigong leads to true self-awareness, tranquillity, and harmony with nature.

    By developing a balance between strength and flexibility, Qigong can also help elders to prevent falls, which can be a major concern. Also, Qigong exercises can help people to maintain and improve vitality and clarity of mind, and prevent a loss of mental faculties.

    For many years in China, and more recently in the West, cancer patients have been taught to use Qigong exercises to stimulate the body’s natural defense mechanisms, and to develop a fighting spirit, which is essential in a healing crisis. Using simple Qigong exercise, many patients can survive cancer by raising the activity of the immune system to a level at which advanced healing may take place, or so they may endure the rigors of Western treatment, such as chemotherapy and radiation. For this reason, acupuncture and other Chinese arts are being studied, recommended as “alternative” healing modalities, and used widely in clinics and hospitals.

    Medical Qigong is the preventive and self-healing aspect of Chinese medicine. Everyone is exposed to stress, whether at home, at work, or just by paying attention to the daily news... Qigong teaches us how to control our reactions to stress and maintain equilibrium, so that life events don’t cause the symptoms of high blood pressure, frustration, or anxiety. Sick people practice Qigong to become well. Healthy people practice qigong to become super-healthy. Healers use qigong to prevent “healer burn-out” and to maintain a positive presence.

    Preventative health practices are relatively new to America, and are quickly gaining popularity, but they have been practiced in China for over 5,000 years. Traditional Chinese medicine treats the whole body with a holistic approach seeking the root of illness, often halting disease before the situation is serious. The Western approach sometimes treats only the symptoms of the illness, after the disease has developed and become more ‘visible’. The Western and Eastern approaches to healing compliment each other well, offering a more complete view of the body which includes both physical and energetic aspects.

    Through the practice of certain Qigong exercises, practitioners can stimulate hormone production, which has many health benefits, such as improved sleep and sexual function, and increased metabolic function.

    New data is discovered regularly by researchers worldwide which demonstrates the importance of understanding the mind/body connection. It is now a major area of study that the cortisol released by the nervous system during times of stress suppresses the immune system, and chronic stress is at epidemic levels. Relaxed breathing and movement can have the reverse effect, allowing the immune system to function optimally. Even a low level of stress, such as a racing mind during a busy work day, noise pollution, or driving in traffic can dramatically lower the immune system response.

    The practice of Qigong is simple to begin, but it can become more complex the further you advance in the training. With the proper foundation of understanding Qigong concepts, a practitioner can train more efficiently and effectively. Even "simple" forms, such as the popular Eight Brocades (Ba Duan Jin) can be used to advance into much deeper "internal" practice, in which you develop your energy body more comprehensively.

    * The bioelectric circulatory system is the system of pathways through which Qi (energy), the life-force, travels throughout the body. These channels and meridians are like rivers and streams, upon which thousands of acupuncture points, or cavities, are located. Of course, every cell of the body contains Qi, but Qi accumulates and circulates differently in different tissues of the body depending on their bioelectrical properties. Researchers in the emerging scientific field of bioelectric research have confirmed that skin conductivity is higher in the acupoints that were discovered by the Chinese thousands of years ago through their intuition and practice. Modern western medicine is just starting to talk about ion channels, and the role of energetics in healing, but we are not going to wait 50 years for their textbook to come out...We practice qigong, and take responsibility for our own health here and now.

    You know, and stuff like that.

    Further reading, article by Master Yang Basic Concepts of Qi and Qigong - Part 1
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2021
  2. Tom bayley

    Tom bayley Valued Member

    it is one thing to say that the mind can influence the immune system. something "the ice man" has clearly demonstrated under rigourus conditions. it is another thing entirely to say that the mind controls the immune system.

    there is also the question of what does controll of the immune system get you? does it mean that you dont get ill ever? that you get ill less often? that if you do get ill you are ill for less time? that if you do get ill you are less severely effected?

    what are you suggesting?
    Dead_pool likes this.
  3. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    "Using simple Qigong exercise, many patients can survive cancer by raising the activity of the immune system to a level at which advanced healing may take place,"

    This is cowardly written to take advantage of cancer sufferers by amoral grifters.

    I am prevented by the TOS from using words that reflect my actual thoughts.
  4. David Silver

    David Silver Member

    @Dead_pool you're right, that is really poorly written, paraphrased from a Chinese document. Im editing it immediately. It is not about money. It also says "so they may endure the rigors of Western treatment, such as chemotherapy and radiation."

    The intention is to say the "qigong exercises are simple", but is not trying to imply that surviving cancer is simple. Its a topic that should be mentioned, but is also difficult to talk about out of context.
    I worked with Helen Liang who had a harrowing experience and amazing recovery from terminal cancer, and made videos in which she shared her experience and exercises she used. But, I do not mean to say that it is some cure all, or easy solution; only to let people know there are now some years of data showing that qigong is commonly PART of many people's recovery from cancer. Qigong and acupuncture are now widely used in hospitals around the world. The acupuncture clinic is often adjacent to the oncology dept for this reason, as at Johns Hopkins and other huge facilities.
  5. David Silver

    David Silver Member

    @Tom bayley maybe the word "influence" is better than control?

    There is a branch of medical science called psychoneuroimmunology, say that three times fast. Its a a relatively new field of study that looks at the interactions between your central nervous system (CNS) and immune system. We're just starting to have an understanding of the complex interaction between hormones and neurotransmitters and cytokines.

    Normally, your body releases pro-inflammatory cytokines in response to an infection or injury to help destroy germs or repair tissue. But when we're STRESSED (mind) our body also releases certain hormones, including epinephrine, adrenaline, and cortisol. These hormones can bind to receptors that signal for the production of pro-inflammatory cytokines, and cause an amazing number of other problems.

    And now, we have chronic stress, all day, every day. So, gaining some "control" over the mind, and remaining relatively calm despite the inevitable stressors we will all face, we exert intentional "control" over these damaging negative stress effects.

    Whether it is new science or ancient Chinese secret, it is clear that our mental state is the major controlling factor in your health on a cellular level, even affecting gene expression.

    There was a 20-year review of data at a huge hospital chain in the US called Kaiser-Permente that found that 80 % of the cases that went through their system of all kinds were "CAUSED BY STRESS". So, yeah, mind control. Deep breathing. Less doom scrolling. Less confrontation and negativity. Not just for hippies anymore. Good vibes, dude.
  6. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    The plural of annecdote isn't data, stop claiming this helps treat cancer, it doesn't, it never has, it never will. Just because you don't understand what happened here, doesn't mean you can claim what you want.

    Original article,
    Helen Liang's Triumph Over Tragedy: Healing Cancer with Tai Chi, Qigong, and Chinese Medicine Part 1

    DVDs about treating cancer for sale;
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2021
  7. Dan Bian

    Dan Bian Neither Dan, nor Brian

    You we're posting on wikipedia in the 90's?

    When it didn't exist in its earliest form until 2001?

    As for the rest. I like YJM's writings on martial arts. I own a few of his books on Tjq. I tend to disregard the "qi/chi" sections as irrelevant as anything other than historical/cultural reference.
    IronMaiden1991 and Dead_pool like this.
  8. David Silver

    David Silver Member

    I've been writing on web forums about qi and learning about the general topic since the 90s. I guess it was 19-20 years ago on wikipedia, not longer. I didn't bother looking it up. I barely know what month it is anymore. Point being, I am interested in this topic and feel like it is misunderstood and missing in some martial arts communities, or as you say disregarded. Qi can be irrelevant when we're young and healthy and athletic and psyched about fighting and external aspects of training. But commonly many older, injured martial artists later in life turn to mind/body arts to function and stay healthy, whether its qigong, tai chi, or your wife's yoga class.
    We can ignore qi and be healthy for a long life and it doesn't matter. But others enjoy working with the body's energetic circulation for specific goals and enjoy great benefits.

    Your brain neurons fired in order for you to think and then compose your reply. Electrical impulses pass through the body in action potentials and ion channels to move your electric meat fingers. Every thought, every movement requires energy. That's qi.

    Many students of YJM have been involved with bringing understanding and scientific research with this topic via the NIH National Institute of Health since the 80s. We're not "making claims". These studies are posted in the New England Journal of Medicine. Harvard Medical School has started talking about qi in the past decade. There is now years of research on this topic of "bioenergy" explained in a lot of detail for anyone interested in learning more than the old paradigm. Its not a thing of the past; its the future of Western medicine.
  9. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    "These studies are posted in the New England Journal of Medicine."

    Can you reference these please, I'd like to take a look.
    IronMaiden1991 likes this.
  10. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Master Helen Liang - Tai Chi Performance & DVD Release | Banyen Books & Sound

    Helen started training at age 4, if she was a chi Kung master already, and chi Kung cures cancer (it doesn't), then why would she if developed the cancer in the first place?

    Hundreds of thousands of people get cancer every year, out of those, some people go into suprise remission naturally, usually due the their immune system happily figuring out how to combat the particular sub type of cancer before it kills them, just because they also do taebo, it doesn't mean it was the taebo that cured the cancer.

    Yes taebo is good at reducing stress, and yes stress can make cancer worse, but it doesn't mean Billy blanks can cure cancer with his own magic hands.

    Stop being silly, and giving cancer patients misleading information. You should be better then that.
  11. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Note about the OP.


    "Video Director, Producer and Sales Director for YMAA Publication Center (YMAA.com).

    I am a video director, producer, filmmaker, musician, and artist. I work at YMAA Publication Center (YMAA.com), producing and directing videos by Dr. Yang, Jwing-Ming, Liang, Shou-Yu, Chenhan Yang, Helen Liang."

    So thats why your making these claims, because that's how you make your income.

    Hope your proud of yourself, making money of cancer victims, and potentially misleading them.

    axelb and Dan Bian like this.
  12. David Silver

    David Silver Member

    I understand its a sensitive topic. I personally, and we all, have lost many people to cancer. It is often impossible to cure and hard to treat.

    Im super not interested in conflict. So, short version. As my profile says, "full-disclosure Im video director at YMAA, student of Dr Yang, etc". I started working there to immerse in qigong, and became certified to teach after six years of study and testing. I have been teaching qigong since 2006 for free, by donation, and it is not about money. I was super sick until I was in my late 20s, and qigong made me healthy.
    You can hyper focus on the sentence about cancer, but "making claims" is not what this thread is about. I have said above that qigong "may help people survive the rigors of chemo", etc. Trying to frame me as a woo woo warrior is just not based in reality and just, nope.

    I liked the part when you said you'd like to learn more about the science. So, this is how it works: in the mid-80s Ramel Rones started working as a consultant at Dana Farber Cancer Institute teaching weekly classes to patients, family, Doctors and nurses, and eventually lead the tai chi / qigong in NIH studies. It took TWENTY FIVE years of those studies to gradually show enough data that the Western medical community is taking the topic much more seriously. It was a big deal that Tai Chi and qi (energy) were mentioned first in 2010 in the N.E. Journal.
    https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa0912611 There are many studies since. Qigong Mind-Body Exercise as a Biopsychosocial Therapy for Persistent Post-Surgical Pain in Breast Cancer: A Pilot Study - PubMed (Peter Wayne at Harvard has also pushed this rock uphill and helped bridge the gap:
    Peter Wayne, PhD - Osher Center For Integrative Medicine)

    They used to say things like "qigong MIGHT give people a feeling of empowerment" or "may give psychosomatic effects". Now they say "Tai Chi improves health by improving the circulation of qi (energy)" etc. So, it is time to catch up on this topic. Way back in the 70s Herb Benson at Harvard Medical School has already demonstrated how the "relaxation response" reduced stress and immediately, reliably improved all health markers. Relaxing involves calming the mind, resulting in slower deeper brainwaves: which are frequencies of energy.

    What we are discussing here is that Qi means energy, and ignore it all you want, you are made of energy and it can be very helpful to understand it for your health and longevity.
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2021
  13. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    I'll have a read tonight, Ive previously spent over a decade in cancer services though, so I'm pretty hard to try and blind with poor quality science.

    Edit: your first link is for "
    A Randomized Trial of Tai Chi for Fibromyalgia "

    Fibro is a) not cancer and b) often includes a large component of mental health issues in the cohort, so much so a 12 week course of SSRIs vastly improves a large section of people with "fibro".

    I hope the rest are more relevent then that.

    Edit your second link was only a pilot study in post operation pain, which again is meaningless.

    Have you got any links to studies that are actually relevent?
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2021
  14. David Silver

    David Silver Member

    No I don't. You won. Topic over. This thread is not about cancer. You can search and find or not find whatever data you want to support your worldview. Qigong does not cure cancer. Im pretty sure no one would say that. I sure didn't.

    I have definitely said repeatedly that qigong is PART of the recovery for cancer nowadays in hospitals in a mainstream and super normal everyday way, not as some rare fringe practice, and that is simply a fact.

    I have been adjacent to these studies and classes for the past 20 years, and a qigong teacher, so don't need *help* understanding things like fibromyalgia or how meaningless the suffering of breast cancer pain management is, thanks. Students tell me directly. Do you have any intention of helping people? That is my goal.

    This thread is definitely still about the other 99.5% of the sentences in my OP.
  15. Dan Bian

    Dan Bian Neither Dan, nor Brian

    I wrote an article a few years ago on my take on "qi/chi".

    David Silver likes this.
  16. David Silver

    David Silver Member

    Bruce wore boxers!
    "It is believed that illness occurs if Chi stagnates in the meridians, causing a blockage. These blockages prevent fresh Chi from circulating to the vital organs and body-parts, thus resulting in a weakening of the affected area. In order to clear these blockages, a patient may undergo procedures such as acupuncture, acupressure or qigong therapy. Practices such as these aim to ‘dissolve’ the stagnant Chi, and promote the flow of fresh Chi, thus restoring health."

  17. Dan Bian

    Dan Bian Neither Dan, nor Brian

    Key part:- "It is believed".

    I dont pretend to be particularly intelligent, or educated in scientific/medical study, but I understand the claims of traditional/alternative therapies are still widely disputed.

    Imo, having "good chi" simply means eating a healthy diet, getting plenty of sleep, and staying physically active to exercise the heart and lungs, as well as maintain the mechanics of the body.
    Yeah, I can see why a two or three letter umbrella term could be used to sum up all of that.
    "You need more Qi!" = "Get your butt off the sofa, put the mcnuggets down, go out for a walk and then get an early night!"

    Also: Bruce wore y-fronts

    Attached Files:

    David Silver and bassai like this.
  18. Xue Sheng

    Xue Sheng All weight is underside

    My wife, A TCM doctor from Beijing, gave me the best description of Qi so far
    Strong Qi you're healthy
    Weak Qi you're sick
    No Qi you're dead
    David Silver likes this.
  19. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    You'd best change all your advertising and products them.

    Yes you did claim that. It's part of the marketing for your products, hence all the videos and interviews.

    Your goal is making money, it is your job, unfortunately in doing this you made some incredibly questionable claims, which can definitely harm people.

    It amazes me anyone would take you seriously after this.
    IronMaiden1991, icefield and Dan Bian like this.
  20. icefield

    icefield Valued Member

    Because Ill people become desperate and clutch at straws and can be easily taken advantage of by those with few morals and out to make money
    Dead_pool likes this.

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