Pressure points? Nonsense or Real?

Regrettably, people can. They buy into it as part of the whole orientophile package, as part of a need to feel special. See also homeopathy, reflexology, new age spirituality and religion.

 

I agree with Knight Errant, well put.

 

I believe in practical pressure points for pain compliance such as philtrum, mastoid etc and I believe in effective targeting of carotid arteries, jaw, temple etc but as for the magical five finger exploding death touch I must say that I am sceptical.

But then again I am just a novice so what do I know!

 

Of course there's pressure points and places that feel unnaturally discomforting, most of these are merely distractions however. A strike to the carotid artery on the side of your neck however with enough force though is one example of where you could at least temporarily disorientate someone as it's the main line of blood flow between your heart and brain. You're not going to KO anyone with it; if you put someone in a choke hold with enough pressure you might but a single strike is just going to disorient someone temporarily so as you can for example put them in a hold before they know what's happening. I don't believe there's a magical way to knock someone out by touching a pressure point though at least not without enough pressure of a choke hold. It's not something I would practice though as it takes about 4 or so seconds to knock someone out with a sleeper hold and not much longer to permanently disable/kill someone.

 

Well I prefer the term "target points" because I don't want to give wrong impression. Yes, they are realistic and realistic means of fighting, however they are not chi related nor effected by "chi balls."

 

well i've trained in Dim-Mak, and i have had doubts as well, but one day i actually used it.

The guy grabbed my arm and i used the stomach 9 point on him and he just fell out, now i didnt hit him i just shoved the area, a little hard. and he was gone...i revived him of course,but ever since that day,i believe.

Now No touch knockouts i still think that is BS

 

....So basically you poked a guy in the neck and he went down?

 

there are presure points that cause a horrible amount of pain, i can say that for sure, i've felt alot of ot at training.

they're just nerves, anyone who's exposed nerves in their teeth will vouch that a tiny contact on a nerve hurts like a trucker!

knockouts? not in my opinnion, if you punch a nerve base hard enough they'll probably go down, then again what does that prove?

 

Pressure points? Sure.....

Aim for the big, spherical one at the top of the neck.
Strike it as hard as you can then, if that doesn't work, do it again.
Lather, rinse, repeat.

 

My take on pressure points is really about how we define them. While I'm not to sure about meridian lines etc, there are definately nerve clusters, veins/arteries and tendons that are close enough to the surface of the skin to be exploited and probably count as pressure points. Examples include the "dead leg" zone of the thigh. This is actually a knock out piont if it hard enough. When struck it causes your body to produce a vast amount of potassium that floods down the nerves and causes the brain to shut down (I'm sure its more complicated but that's my simple understanding). The achilles tendon is another, there are nerve clusters under the arms, the top of the skull, towards the front, is weak enough to be seperated from the main skull section. The list goes on. The important point however is that it is not magic, or chi, its simple physiology correctly applied.

 

i remember hearing potassium and calcium like.

Easy way to think is nerves carry electic signals if you punch/poke squeese whatever you bassically shorth circut the nerves

 

There are weak points on the body that if held or struck correctly will put you down with minumum effort. I remember my instructor was showing us someself defense and pressed down on a soft piece on my shoulder with his forefinger and instantly i fell to my knees every time. I have used that technique twice now..one was a street fight and instantly he was down on the knees. You hold the spot with the fore finger for a second or two instead of just jabbing at it

 

Yes some are real, most are kung fu master wanna be bs. Military uses some for restraining( Finger between the color bones below the neck widely used) but crap like "dim mak". I mean come on?

 

I know this Asian guy who hates whites for the Opium problem, I know this Indian guy who hates whites for the Tea Taxing problem, I know this White guy who hates American Indians for the Tobbaco problem, I know a Hippy who hates the Columbians for his Pot Problem, I know this fat lady who hates the French for their Pastry Problem....

 

Here's an odd thingie for your amusement.

Some years ago a friend of mine,N. Shaolin practitioner,was running a little chin na class for awhile.5 of us from various systems and a couple of our students.

So one day we've just finished working on some lock and getting ready to work on another,and as he walks by me he reaches out and gently strokes down around my left ear.

My left leg crumpled for an instant.Just kinda went dead.Felt like an electric shock went down it.

?????

I said something to the effect of "that was interesting",but I never asked him about it,never been that concerned with such things.I'll try and remember to ask him about it next time I run into him,which is pretty rare these days.

Now I'd known this guy for years and we'd banged each other about numerous times so not only was there no psychological set up like some of the one touch KO seminar guys do,or any "awe" on my part, but he'd never even said anything about this type of thing-so it was totally out of the blue.

I'd add that he was not a mysterious type,actually was a quite capable real world brawler-not a big guy either.

Now,could he pull it off in a confrontation?I'm pretty sure if it was possible I'd have probably felt it at some previous time when we were doing non-gloved sparring.Knowing him and the way we "played" together in those days.

 

Sorry, I haven't taken the time to read through the entire thread (just the last 2 pages), but WRT knock-outs via striking the brachial plexus, it's not really too difficult for a trained MAist (per the linked video).

I happen to be very familiar with the "Karate Expert" in that video. His name is Jay Lee and not then, but now has a PhD in physical education. At the time this video was made, he was an instructor for Kuk Sool Won™. Visible next to him, is his classmate at the time and current chief master of the United Martial Science Federation, Marlin Sims. While I don't believe Mr. Sims ever participated here on MAP, several of his students have as well as Dr. Lee (drjaylee).



As to the use of PP in MA, most of the acupuncture points that are prescribed for pain-compliance techniques, just happen to coincide with other anatomical details - such as a good place to pinch a nerve between your finger & the underlying bone (Lung-7 being one that's quite popular in HKD). Other PP, as has been noted, rely on attacking things such as large blood vessels, which when struck employs the baroreceptor reflex which can make someone pass out if struck with enough force. The "dim mak" myth is IMO perpetuated by the fact that a blow to certain visceral organs can cause eventual death due to things such as internal hemorrhaging, which in olden days couldn't be fixed even if they knew what was causing the symptoms (dizziness, nausea, general & local discomfort, etc.). Actual "delayed death touch" is a hoax easily dismissed with modern understanding of physiology. So PP do exist, but any mumbo-jumbo about Ki/Chi/Qi (氣) is simply the TCM method of explaining what can actually be explained differently (and more accurately) with western medical science. FWIW



EDIT:
I forgot to mention that if someone is strung out on PCP or is otherwise in a drugged state of some kind, "pain-compliance" pressure points that work wonderfully in a classroom setting, may not have any noticeable effect. Other PP usage which relies on autonomic reflexes for effectiveness, however, should work no matter what.

 

Are you, by chance, referring to xue hai xue (血海穴 - SP10)? With leg straight and placing the tip of your index finger on the center of your patella (same side), the tip of your outstretched thumb should be fairly close to this point which translates as "sea of blood." As best I understand it, the baroreceptor reflex I mentioned in my previous post plays a role in how striking this PP can effect disorientation in your opponent. While not as effective as striking the vagus nerve which is exposed along the carotid sheath of the neck (together with the carotid artery & jugular vein), the femoral artery, the femoral vein, and the femoral nerve lie relatively exposed directly under this acupoint. Even if not causing dizziness or lightheadedness from striking this point, if you manage to rupture either the femoral artery or vein, then the person could "bleed out" internally in a mater of minutes (these are the largest blood vessels located below the waist BTW). No doubt where this PP got it's name.

 

Yep. This all can be perform accurately on a moving about adversary in a actual fisticuff

 

... in dreams.