I found this video. I liked it so I thought I'd share and try to get a critique from those with informed opinions... [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMM3hVp-1Ag"]YouTube - Lost History-Ninja Lore[/ame] When I say "critique" I'm specifically referring to the accuracy of the information. I'm sure people will have different opinions regarding the presentation, but that's not really what I'm asking about. Personally I think it's well done but I lack the expertise to determine if the information is good. What do those of you that have a background in Ninjutsu think of this video? Is it good? Is it incomplete? Does it serve as a starting point for more research or is it totally wrong? If there are any glaringly inaccurate statements please make a note of them. I'll be curious to see how those of you that know more than I do respond.
Ha! I've watched this video a number of times and I never caught that... Good ear. I'm pretty sure he meant "the ninja"
With your warning, I lasted a few seconds more until they started talking about how 'the ninjutsu' was illegal under samurai rule. If they start out with that premise, I am not going to waste 8 minutes of my life watching it and who knows how much time detailing all the hundreds of errors it probably has.
Hi KidKrav, Considering the shortness of the video I would say overall it does a good job. The historical images are badly chosen at times but for most people that will not matter. Another mistake is that the Ninja re-appeared in movies almost 100 years ago (eg Koga Unôn Ninjutsu Kogaryû from 1916) and frequently appeared in fictional novels too. A lot missing though.
I sat through it all and I have to say it was pretty horrible. When it started going on about the Lin Kuei prowling the forests as the forerunners of the ninja, it became pretty obvious that the writer/presenter had basically just done some Google searches, read some Wikipedia pages (he even shows one) and just pieced together some images into a sort of montage. You're probably better off looking at something like "Shinobi - Winds of the 34 Generations." It's not perfect by any means but it's better researched and more interesting and includes interviews with senior figures like Hatsumi sensei, Manaka sensei, Stephen K Hayes and so on.
About a minute in the title of the series, Lost History a .com Search, is displayed. I think it's fair to say that the age of information has yet to catch up to the ninja but I give the guy in the video credit for trying to shed some light. If I knew of a reputable online source that contained basic information on the topic I wouldn't have posted this video. Thanks for the suggestion. I'll be sure to check it out. So the tactics of espionage (if it would be correct to call it espionage) were not frowned upon by the Samurai? My understanding was that the Samurai and military elite of Feudal Japan frowned upon the tactics of the Ninja, but at the same time they needed them to achieve their own objectives. Could it not be argued that this paradox contributed to the existence of and secrecy surrounding the Ninja? If I'm incorrect someone please explain. This is something which is very difficult to find good information on, hence the reason for creating this thread. That's a little disappointing. You seem to be one of the more well informed and level headed posters here and I would have been interested to see your opinions regarding more of the information he presents. I'm hoping that the early negative reactions do not inhibit conversation in this thread. If you don't want to watch the whole clip please watch from 1:38-7:00 as this is the portion which concerns the historic ninja. I think a discussion by the Ninjutsu community regarding what is accurate and inaccurate between 1:38-7:00 of this clip will greatly help to clarify the details of the historic Ninja. Thank you to all who choose to participate.
This is trash. Don't even waste your time watching the video. Edit: I've been saying it for years on this forum. When will people understand that there is no such thing as a historic Ninja. They aren't a class or a sub-class of people. They can't be classed like Spartans, Vikings or Samurai. They didn't exist as a group of people. Ninja is a description, an adjective, throughout Japanese history many groups of people have been 'ninja', Samurai, Yamabushi, Ronin. There is no coherent history, no beginning, no curriculum (passed down over 9000 years). Anyways, there you go. Video is bs.
To be blunt, a lot of what you are asking should be answered with the phrase, "It depends." Instead of yes of no, answers can be a lot more nuanced. Really, to go through everything would require a hell of a lot of typing. Instead, how about you go read stuff by respected folks and ask us questions about what they write instead of stuff like this.
I'm afraid Kidkrav that Don is correct. I thought about typing up a little explanation for you but every time I came up with a good example I ended up adding "apart from." I mean I often compare the ninja to the OSS and SOE but it's not true, even if they shared some similar skillsets. But then not all of them did. See how confusing it gets? The problem is that the people to whom the term "ninja" (and the wide range of other terms used at different times) is usually applied were such a broad spectrum that as Ace says, you can't just point at one group and say "that's ninja that is." Even if you limit yourself to one aspect and look at say the Iga no Mono, you find it difficult. But this isn't any kind of grand plan to vanish into the mists of history or some kind of mad conspiracy as the ninja secretly plot towards world domination. It's just that unlike the term "samurai", which pointed to a specific social caste that enabled you to say "that's a samurai, that isn't" (and even that gets massively confusing depending upon time period), you couldn't say "that's a ninja, that's not", simply because "ninja" was a label that could apply to several entities. Even the term "ninja" is not correct, I'm just using it here for simplicity. So when people like Antony Cummins try to pin down what a ninja is or isn't, they're simply trying to reduce something down to a manageable chunk and end up throwing the baby out with the bathwater. But it's also worth noting that this ambiguity does not allow for anything and everything to be labelled "ninja." Take the "ninjutsu" found in the Bujinkan for example. This is a very broad spectrum of skills used in certain geographical areas. They are essentially a broad base of combat skills (conventional and unconventional) that were used by the people of that region. Those skills included intelligence gathering and esoteric knowledge. Even as I'm writing this I'm aware of how flawed my own description is so you can imagine how difficult it can be to come up with a definition that actually stands analysis. Anyway, maybe it helps, I don't know.
KidKrav, Karl Friday's work would be a good place to start. It'll give you a solid foundation to build on, from that you can then get into specific areas which interest you.
Recently posted by EWBell: www.ninpo.org Huge amount of info and it's been available for YEARS. Accurate information on the enemy's movements, numbers, food stores, and arms are, IMO, the most important factors in determining the outcome of war. These people took war VERY seriously. It's possible they publicly decried these methods while at the same time secretly taking part in them. I think this would have more to do with avoiding retaliation than actually finding it distasteful. While I can understand that you may find it disappointing, please understand that when Don wanted this information, he went to Japan. He didn't ask a bunch of nameless people on the internet. He didn't hit up wikipedia. He spent time effort and money to become "more well informed". As far as the video goes, I'm at work so no audio. Pictures look pretty.:hat:
I'd like to apologize to you guys for taking so long to respond. People have have made some good points that I want to address, but it's taking me some time to gather thoughts.
If you are taking time to consider things instead of just whipping out a response, that IMO shows a measure of intelligence and respect for others.
