Pathwalker Guild

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by Saturnine138, Jan 4, 2006.

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  1. Ex Pathwalker

    Ex Pathwalker Valued Member

    Marbo School of Martial Arts and Survival

    OK, that was an A+ whitewash. Let's keep this simple. Can you tell the forum what you know about the things you are talking about?, but not detailing?, i.e.

    • marbo History
    • quality of instruction
    • the standard of instructors
    • the progression of members
    • the (honourable) aims of the org

    You claim you hardly know the main instructor, and yet talked to him recently, which leads me to believe you are closer to the instructors than you want to make out. Speaking from experience, the way you speak of the organisation displays the narcissistic tendencies that a large number of marbo instructors used to exhibit, which is why i think this.

    If marbo is such a brilliant system, please tell us more! Please tell us about what you know about the above. I'm happy to trade stories about the above going back at least 20 years for the benefit of everyone on this forum, and for those in the future who might want to join the system. Over to you.
  2. aikiwolfie

    aikiwolfie ... Supporter

    Yeah doing a great job of not being drawn into the "tit-for-tat" there. As for the supposed obsession. It might be or not be the case. However it's not all that unreasonable for people to keep tabs on an organisation that has gained a bad reputation. Especially if those people doing the watching are the ones who got their fingers burnt.

    An interesting fact about human nature. People pay more attention to those they consider dangerous. So you got people's attention and not in the good way. Just a tad too late to complain it's not fair.
  3. OwlMAtt

    OwlMAtt Armed and Scrupulous

    I guess I'm late to the party, but here's my two cents after checking out the web site:

    (A) In my experience, martial arts organizations that boast of "street defense" are almost always teaching nonsense.
    (B) When I go to the sales section of a martial arts organization's web site, I expect to see martial arts equipment, not "Path Books" and "Fire Rings" that look like items to be collected in a role-playing video game.
    (C) What the heck is a zamora? The web site says it's "ancient", but Google can't find it anywhere, which makes me think the Marbo guys made it up.
    (D) There is no mention anywhere on the web site of the history or pedigree of the Marbo martial art. Most martial arts organizations are very proud of their history and feature it prominently on their web sites. A site advertising an art I've never heard of but not telling me anything about it except that it's "awesome" scares me.
    (E) "At The PG Sanctuary there is no sign on the wall to indicate the presence of the Pathwalker Guild; It isn't necessary. Those who need to know, know, and those who need to ask, have no right to know. Knowledge and experience of The Pathwalker Sanctuary is a privilege of membership, not a right."
    Words like this make me wonder if I'd be welcome as a newcomer.
    (F) The name "Pathwalker Guild" sounds like something out of a young adult fantasy novel.

    Any one of these things would cause me to approach cautiously, but all these things together are a big, red sign proclaiming: DELUSIONAL FANBOYS HERE--STAY CLEAR.
  4. Ex Pathwalker

    Ex Pathwalker Valued Member

    OwlMatt - One of the stock answers you may get here from this particular bunch (if any of them return to the forum), will relate to the exclusivity of their organisation and the zamora etc, them being an invite only closed society etc. As Mojoja and I discussed above in the thread, such groups don't make books available on their techniques or write websites about it or have public clubs etc. Anything you comment about with them will be heavily defended, unless you agree with what they are saying / doing.
  5. Marbo member

    Marbo member Banned Banned

    Owl Mat
    From my limited experience of the Marbo org, the following response to your points A-F
    A. Our self defense methods and techniques have been taught to students, teachers, social workers, nurses of the Royal College of Nursing, members of the Police and quite a few soldiers. I have seen some of the comments from these and they have all been positive. I’ve been taught some of the Marbo self defense techniques like escaping wrist grabs, throat grabs and defense against knives and other stuff. I’ve worked in the security industry and the techniques I learned worked for me.
    B. We don’t use much equipment and the “shop” section on the web site is intended to cater to members needs, so not much there. The “Firering” is going through the patent process and was invented by the main man, its Ferro cerium and brilliant for use in Survival and Bushcraft. Other similar products are in the pipeline and will be available when ready. The Red Path book is exactly that, a book about the history, pedigree, of the “Marbo” org, its methods, techniques, grading system, Protocols and much more. All the questions I had when I joined were answered in this book.
    C. Our personal weapon, the Zamora, has its roots in Arabia and N Africa. Originally the stick used to beat the ritual drum during gatherings in the desert and mountains the stick made its way to Ireland where it now beats the Bodhran drum and is known as a “Tipper”. The two main types of Zamora used by the Pathwalker are the Dewkak and the Atsar, both have specific self defence applications. Both Dewkak and Atsar, as well as the less popular Domar can be found mentioned in Sir R Burtons translations of old Arabic/Aramaic texts.
    D. I’ve asked why there is not more on the web site about the pedigree of the art and have to agree with the response that it is a private members only non-sport org and as such has no reason to trumpet its existence or go into detail publicly. Until the seventies little was written about the methods and techniques, it was a dyadic tradition. This has changed as the org adapts to the times, but again, it’s a private members only org. The branches fill quite quickly and then the members get on with training, visiting Crogen for gradings and conservation work and visiting the Sanctuary again for training, respite from hectic lifestyles and holiday breaks, which brings me to;
    E. Because of the location of the Sanctuary and the proximity of Bears and other potentially dangerous wildlife, and the culture, it is vital that those members visiting have the right inoculations and preperation, including a 2-4 hour induction about said dangers and culture, a few words and phrases that can help and awareness of the cultural differences in order to avoid causing offence. All our members are entitled to visit the Sanctuary but the casual visitor would encounter difficulties as mentioned, hence the comment you made re “Those who know” etc.
    F.When struggling to define our org the main man returned to the Guild definition, this fully describes/defines our org, by the members for the members, craft etc. As our martial art is not in any way suitable for competition or tournament it better fit’s the definition of a craft.

    Much of our terminology is Arabic as the main mans instructor was from over that way (Al Musafir)
    I hope this goes some way towards your understanding of the org I am proud to be a member of. When we have spaces in our branches we welcome people from all walks of life, religions and politics. Here is a quote from the main man;
    “The continued friendships enjoyed by ex members , born from the fires of their efforts, their training partnerships, mutual assistance, and social gatherings, is testimony to the purpose of the organisation, that is; The Marbo Pathwalker organisation brings together people from diverse backgrounds, religions and races, to train together in this most unique art, cultivating those skills that serve to protect the individual, their friends , families and way of life, adhering to the principles of compassion, tolerance and mutual assistance.” Ricon MPG
    If you want to know more or try our training contact the members secretary through the web site to see if there's a branch in your area and if there is a space. When we open a new branch we prefer current members to invite freinds and family because they know the person and the person will have been told what our training and membership entails. We also put up posters and hand out leaflets etc. We dont allow spectators but many new members simply walk in off the street and try a session.
    I love a healthy debate, I love people agreeing with my viewpoint, but I also love it when I’ve been persuaded by another’s. This is why I joined this forum, healthy respectful discussion and debate. I’m happy to say I’ve never met a Marbo member I wouldn’t be happy to train with, eat with or feel comfortable with, but I am glad "Ex member" is an Ex member for reasons made obvious by his attitude in his posts. I will now bid you adieu as I’m part of the Pathwalker charity team planning this years event. “Ex member” will no doubt call this “whitewash” I don’t think the members will agree with him, or the recipients of the much needed help we will provide. The sun is shining, life is good, I’m off, Ta Ta!
  6. OwlMAtt

    OwlMAtt Armed and Scrupulous

    They can defend it all they want. In fact, I hope they do. I'd love to hear them explain some of this. Who in the Pathwalker Guild has extensive enough "street defense" experience to teach it? How come the pictures all show Asian martial arts techniques but the themes on the web site are all Western? Where can I find information about the supposedly ancient zamora? From what culture does it originate? What does a "Fire Ring" have to do with martial arts training? Where did the Marbo system come from in the first place? Who invented it and what was his/her/their martial arts background?

    These aren't attacks; these are just questions, reasonable questions that any prospective member would be prudent to ask.
  7. Gripfighter

    Gripfighter Sub Seeker

    this is some Edgar Allan Poe gear.
  8. Polar Bear

    Polar Bear Moved on

    It's all obviously crap and made up by some fanboys. Doesn't take sherlock holmes to figure that one out.

    The Bear.
  9. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    *looks at website*

    Absolute bollocks. Delusional LARP'ing of the highest order.

    FWIW the "zamora" looks like every other palm stick variant found globally
  10. aikiwolfie

    aikiwolfie ... Supporter

  11. Ex Pathwalker

    Ex Pathwalker Valued Member

    As predicted, a long post relating to the exclusivity of the organisation, being a private members only organisation etc. I won't call it a whitewash again, I'll only get told i have an attitude.

    OK - If people reading this string go back up to posts #5, #8 and #25 (which started in 2006), they will read that people had bad experiences with the Pathwalker Guild. I started my posts at post #28.

    So, Marbo Member can you please tell us a little more about why people left the Marbo organisation throughout the years please?, because that's a common thread running through this string, regardless of how much 'history' you post on behalf of the organisation, and how many apologies you make above in post #36.

    You clearly have quick access to a man you hardly know (to quote your own post), so accepting that, and accepting the fact that you love a healthy debate, can you tell us why so many people left the Marbo Pathwalker Guild?

    I agree in part Hannibal - what they are currently referring to as Zamora, Dewkak, Atsar, Domar etc, can be found in many cultures across the world with varying but very similar uses. Elsewhere it's called the Kakarro, the Yawarra, Tabak, Kubotan, Dulodulo, Olisi Palid, Koppo, Pasak etc - or as you say now more commonly known as the Palm Stick. A name is just a name.

    What's termed as the Zamora is not exclusive to this organisation, just like the shoe or the pan aren't exclusive practical devices either, funnily enough they vary across the world too.
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 16, 2012
  12. Marbo member

    Marbo member Banned Banned

    A Marbo members reply

    To the guy who said the "palm stick" can be found everywhere, yes. The only difference is the way it is used and then the differences are minimal. I've done the Zamora day trainer and its application was a real extension of the Marbo techniques rather than a seperate weapon system like I studied under my Karate instructor.
    To Owl Matt. The modern founder has more experience of street defence than anyone I've met and I've met many so-called experts. Re Asian martial arts. Where are the Crane, Monkey, Tiger, Mantis or Hamster techniques? Two arms and two legs, many systems will be similar to the casual observer, a kick is a kick as the man said. The origin of the art is as far as we know Arabic, our chief instructor being the scion of Al Musafir, before that only he would know. The "Fire ring" has nothing to do with martial arts, but it has a lot to do with the Pathwalker. The fire ring is based on the flint ring carried by Pathwalkers including our chief instructor, for over 35yrs. The fire ring is being patented as I write, it is a great piece of kit and I have used it quite a few times "on the hill" here and abroad more than once. Dont dish something you have not tried, including Marbo!. You are right about reasonable questions but hey, I love the training and I've tried other systems over many years so I know what I'm doing. The org is very professionally run and everyone I've met have always been keen, happy and freindly, no back biting or crap, but please back off a bit eh, I'm not laying into anyone else on this forum and thers a lot of sharks out there.
  13. Marbo member

    Marbo member Banned Banned

    Marbo is cool

    Hello again ex-member. A response to your last negative post. You really do have issues eh! In response to your comment; " You claim you hardly know the main instructor and yet you talked to him recently" What is your problem with this, talk about nit picking!. I've spoken to many people over the past 24hrs I've never met before! Of course I can speak to the main instructor, we all can, we all have his contact details just as we have the members secretary details, its an organisation! Do you have the contact details of your bank, your boss, your garage etc? of course you do, we communicate!. What kind of paranoid obsessive planet do you live on! I do not understand why you feel the need to insult me and those I train with, they are all great people without exception, no games, no cliques, no gossip, a healthly respect for each other and each others beliefs and lives. You want to "Trade stories" why??? Get a life my freind, my stories are private. Those in the future who wish to join Marbo have nothing to do with you or me for that matter. I've had enough of you slagging a great org so I'm off to do some push ups and a laugh with the guys. As I said before. The sun is shining, spring is coming and life is good. Peace.
  14. monkeywrench

    monkeywrench Valued Member

    (600th Post! w00t!!)
  15. aikiwolfie

    aikiwolfie ... Supporter

    Well he clearly feels Marbo did wrong by him. Not too hard to work out. And here you are with your whole "damage limitation" speech.

    What capacity exactly are you acting in on Marbo's behalf? Do you represent them in an official capacity?

    The reason I'm asking is because free advertising is not allowed on MAP. And thus far rather than actually concentrate on the issues raised. You've spent as the majority of your time here telling us Marbo is great and cool etc.

    The only reason you've been allowed to continue posting is because Marbo has taken a rough hit in this thread and I felt it was only fair to give someone from Marbo the chance to address the concerns expressed by MAP members posting here.

    So I'd appreciate less sales pitch and more problem resolution.
  16. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    Does this page talk about effective self defence whilst showing a practitioner performing a side kick to middle section with a horizontal body position whilst in snow?

    I wish you and your fellows every success and enjoyment in your training but I have to say that some aspects of your website, if not your training, may need modifying.

  17. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    I am being less kind - I bet I see more action In one month than any one of these LARPtards
  18. aikiwolfie

    aikiwolfie ... Supporter

    Is it me or is every photo on that web site intentionally blurry to prevent you from looking at it too closely? Dear god my eyes are bleeding now.
  19. Dean Winchester

    Dean Winchester Valued Member


    I feel like I need to be deprogrammed after looking at that site and some of Marbo Member's responses and the language used in the posts hasn't helped.

    But hey that's probably just me being negative in my negative reality. :rolleyes:
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2012
  20. Dean Winchester

    Dean Winchester Valued Member

    So what are the fundamentals of this system?

    How does it all interconnect and what is its make up?

    That could mean anything.

    It could mean you need to get out more and widen your social circle.

    It could mean he's failed on multiple occasions at the basic level of self protection.

    As you've mentioned experts that you've met could you let us know which ones you are on about?

    You've given little in the way of details.

    What research has been done and what sources have been used for you to reach this conclusion?

    If its origin is Arabic then we should see certain things within the system to indicate its evolution. What are they?

    Problem is that the website and your responses here do not make a good impression.

    What systems have you tried and where does this one differ to those?

    So are most used car sales men......

    To paraphrase Mr DeBecker "There is no such thing as a charming person only a person who uses charm".

    Here's a hint!

    You are trying too hard ;)

    Last edited: Mar 18, 2012
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