Ninjitsu & Ju Jitsu Related???

Discussion in 'Ninjutsu' started by Acekicken, Dec 30, 2002.

  1. Acekicken

    Acekicken Submission Fighter

    I've heard that some Samuri were in fact Ninjas
    With this being a fact.

    Then i will have to awsume that Ninjitsu & Ju jitsu
    Are related.----------------------------------


    What do u guy's think?????/
  2. Brad Ellin

    Brad Ellin Baba

    Saying that Ninjutsu and Ju Jitsu are related is like saying that Hip Hop and Bluegrass are related in that both are a form of music. However, you could make the argument that the Ninja's fighting art (taijutsu) and Ju Jitsu could be related. I have seen many similarities between the two. Important to remember that Ninjutsu is not the fighting art of the Ninja, but the "whole" art of the Ninja, which includes everything from combat skills, to calligraphy to psycolgy to weather forcasting to espionage skills and so on and so forth. Is this true about Ju Jitsu?
  3. Acekicken

    Acekicken Submission Fighter

    Blue Grass & Hip Hop

    Samuri & The Ninja

    Perhapse The Blue Grass can be sampeld for hip hop

    But if Samuri were in fact Ninja
    Then again i say they
    are related
  4. Jim_Jude

    Jim_Jude New Member


    THE 18 SKILLS OF THE NINJA (as per Takamatsu Toshitsugu)
    (*if you got a problem, take it up with him!*)

    1.Seishin teki kyoyo (spiritual refinement)
    2.Taijutsu (unarmed combat)
    3.Ninja ken (ninja sword)
    4.Bojutsu (stick and staff fighting)
    5.Shurikenjutsu (throwing blades)
    6.Yarijutsu (spear fighting)
    7.Naginatajutsu (halberd fighting)
    8.Kusarigama (chain and sickle weapon)
    9.Kayakujutsu (fire and explosives)
    10.Hensojutsu (disguise and impersonation)
    11.Shinobi iri (stealth and entering methods)
    12.Bajutsu (horsemanship)
    13.Sui ren (water training)
    14.Bo-ryaku (strategy)
    15.Cho ho (espionage)
    16.Intonjutsu (escape and concealment)
    17.Ten-mon (meteorology)
    18.Chi-mon (geography)


    That being said...

    Taijutsu. What is it?

    In Classical Bujutsu the term Taijutsu is often interchangible with Jujutsu, along with a slew of other words such as hade, hakuda, jujutsu, kempo (Sekiguchi-ryu, Araki-ryu, Seigo-ryu), koppo (Koto Ryu), kogusoku, and koshi no mawari (Takenouchi-ryu and Yagyu Shingan-ryu), kowami, kumiuchi, shubaku, taijutsu (Yagyu Shingan-ryu), tode, torite, yawara[jutsu] (Tenshin Shoden Katori Shinto-ryu, Tatsumi-ryu and Shosho-ryu), and yoroi kumiuchi (Yagyu Shingan-ryu).

    These can all be defined as "basic methods of attack include hitting or striking, thrusting or punching, kicking, throwing, pinning or immobilizing, strangling, and joint-locking."

    Of course, each school has their own specific waza/kata, & may lean more towards grappling or striking, but as a rule koryu bujutsu didn't specialize, & couldn't really afford to. Of course, after the Sengoku Jidai, you could do whatever you wanted, because your screw-ups probably wouldn't cost you your life on the battlefield.

    As far as Ninjutsu & Jujutsu being related, just one example, Kukishin Ryu contains both, specifically. & many Ryu-ha, including Yagyu Shingan-ryu, use Taijutsu & Jujutsu interchangibly.

    So I'd be more apt to say that certain aspects of Ninjutsu, such as its forms of Ninpo Taijutsu are directly related to Classical Jujutsu.

    Ninja are what Samurai could be if they dropped the whole Honorable Bushido thing. The only things that separate Ninja from the average Samurai were Hensojutsu (disguise and impersonation), Shinobi iri (stealth and entering methods), Cho ho (espionage), & Intonjutsu (escape and concealment), & I'm sure that at one time or another, some Samurai somewhere hid in the shadows, or put on a disguise in order to win.
    Ever seen "Seven Samurai"? The Samurai that shaved his head & dressed up as a monk to take out the kidnapper? Worked like a charm. & that Samurai that snuck out in the middle of the night to take out the brigand riflemen? He came back with one or two.

    Things weren't so black & white as people would like to think. Never have been, & never will be. The winners have always used what works. That's how they won.
  5. Brad Ellin

    Brad Ellin Baba

    Well put and Thank you Jim, I learn new things everyday!
  6. Acekicken

    Acekicken Submission Fighter

    That is a great deal of info Thanks for sharing
    I was kind of looking more towards YES or No
    But that will work tooooooooooo
  7. Freeform

    Freeform Fully operational War-Pig Supporter

    Being a practitioner of Goshin Do Tai Jitsu I'd say that Ju Jitsu and Tai Jutsu are are pretty much similar styles just of different lineages. Also they are just words.

    If I were to open a 'School of throwing' at my local sports centre what do you think I was throwing? people? footballs? bowls? chickens?

    Samurai (Bujutsu)and Ninja (Ninjutsu) were just two different schools of war, each were bound to have their own terminology. Its quite possible that you could be versed in two schools, many people today have more than one University degree qualification.

    You could also argue that the teaching of each school were mutually exclussive to each other it terms of personal morality, Samurai prefering a more overt role.

    Just a thought to get your juices going.

  8. Spike

    Spike New Member

    "You could also argue that the teaching of each school were mutually exclussive to each other it terms of personal morality, Samurai prefering a more overt role."

    This was my understanding, so far as i was aware, the Samurai weren`t aloud to use any of the tactics the ninja did.
  9. natxanadu

    natxanadu Banned Banned

    Apparently there are 9schools within Bujinkahn 6 of them are Jujutsu Schools while only 3 are Ninjutsu
  10. Jim

    Jim New Member

    Kinda a moot point because Ninja's didn't and don't exist anyway. :D

    (Sitting back and waiting for the *BOOM*)
  11. Spike

    Spike New Member

    How can that be true, I`ve seen them on the telly
  12. Freeform

    Freeform Fully operational War-Pig Supporter

    They weren't really Ninjas Spike, you saw them didn't ya!
  13. pgm316

    pgm316 lifting metal

    I've seen them on TV look!


  14. Juzo

    Juzo New Member

    Most Ninja were actually Samurai. The Samurai and any higher class were the only ones who had a family name and an actual name. Looking at most Ninja, they had first names and last names, which means they were either Samurai, or had ancestors who were Samurai. Peasants usually either named themselves with a single name, or with an "of ____" to refer to where they were from. For eg. Kumakawa was from the Koga region, so his name was Koga no Kumakawa (young bear from Koga).

    Bujinkan consists of 9 ryuha of Bujutsu. 3 being Ninpo, and 6 that come from various other Bujutsu. Jujutsu came about in around the year 1540. The arts of the Bujinkan predate Jujutsu in origin.
  15. Freeform

    Freeform Fully operational War-Pig Supporter

    Ah, yes young grasshopper, but Yawara Jutsu predates them all and is in fact the precursor to most Japanesse MA.

  16. Acekicken

    Acekicken Submission Fighter

    Chikura Kurabe is as old as Yawara

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