New Judo Move

Discussion in 'Judo' started by inkpen, Feb 21, 2015.

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  1. jazzysingh

    jazzysingh Valued Member

    I tend to agree with the above quote... Having said that as others have pointed out, its a contact sport and this kind of thing will happen whether intentionally/accidentally. It is hard for you to see this happen to your son, but I guess you really do need to put it in the past and just focus on your son training hard so he can continue to love the sport in the future. I know its easier for me to say 'forget it' than it is for you to do so but it probably is something you want to move forward from. I am sure the majority can see it seemed deliberate.
     
  2. matveimediaarts

    matveimediaarts Underappreciated genius

    Cheers! :)

    For those with more judo experience than I-is it easy to accidentally lose grip (or whatever might happen in the heat of the moment) and hit your opponent? I found it easy to avoid hitting my partner when I did judo, but I only went for 9-10 months or so because it turned out to be a lousy club.
     
  3. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    I don't think it was as deliberate as the slow motion makes it look.
    As I see it the kid on top is trying to maintain a grip on the right lapel. Kid on the bottom starts to bring his legs into play and the grip is 'popped' off (hence why it looks like a pull back action).
    Kid on top then tries to go for the left lapel instead and gets a bit frantic because kid on bottom might wriggle out. As he reaches in his hand hits the face instead and then lapel grabs right after.
    The fact it's described as a tiger claw or open hand when it lands supports the notion he was attempting a re-grip rather than some spurious notion this kid also trains tiger claw kung full or something.
    It's not a nice thing to have happened and I'd probably DQ the top kid for being to reckless but it's hardly grounds for anything legal or all this who-har imho.
     
  4. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Just realised I got the lapel sides mixed up. Swap 'em.
     
  5. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    I've done much worse than that when shooting for a top grip. I wouldn't want people scrutinising those incidents in slow motion after the match
     
  6. inkpen

    inkpen Valued Member

    Guys I do not want the kid banned. I have no intention of taking legal action. We can all make mistakes in the heat of the moment.

    I do think he should watch the footage with his coach & parents & be given a warning/explanation that such striking to the face is not permissible. This is to protect the next opponent he is on top of in a similar situation. It is also in the best interests of the kid himself - to prevent him injuring an opponent.

    Despite what our eminent and doubtless medically knowledgeable Moi proclaims, a 10yo who is on top of his opponent and punches down on the face of his opponent beneath him, from a position where his arm has been drawn back behind his head, could do serious injury to the head or neck. The effects of concussion on the brain, especially in a kid of 7yo, can be very damaging and have long term consequences.

    Primarily this is a safety issue and my main concern is the message that JFA is sending out when they refuse to condemn this action, and therefore in effect condone it.
    They are not placing the safety of the players above all else. This is also a bad look for judo. It is not a good advertisement for the sport.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2015
  7. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    He's doing judo and you're clutching at straws over a punch! There's a lot more legitimate harm to be had in judo whether intended or accidental. This was nothing that was very possibly accidental.
    Primarily this is a Dad with his knickers in a twist because he believe his son was beaten unfairly. Judo is a well managed sport and I've never met an instructor that didn't look after their kids. You don't need to bring more safety in and you certainly don't want to be gunning for a poor 11? Year old kid as the incident is approaching a year ago. That's a long time for a kid
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2015
  8. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    The JFA doesn't recognise it as a punch. I tend to agree with them. It looks like he was aiming for the lapel and missed, clipping your boy's jaw on the way through. His reaction afterwards does not fit that of a violent outburst either.
     
  9. inkpen

    inkpen Valued Member

    Moi, I thought I had made it clear that I have no desire to crucify the striker. But I obviously have not. So here goes again! I do not want the kid to be banned or charged or in any way penalised. I simply think he should have to watch the footage with his parents & coach & have it explained to him that such an action is against the rules and could injury the opponent. He should be warned not to repeat. End of story as regards consequences for the striker. Information I have received suggests none of these measures have been implemented.

    Neurologists claim that sports related concussion places paediatric athletes at greater risk of sustaining and experiencing lasting effects of brain injury. My son was stunned for a brief period after this strike to his face that slammed his head into the mat. He suffered recurring headaches for a period after this incident. I consider I am fully justified in taking issue with JFA for not condemning this action. They need to send a loud message that the safety of judo players, especially junior players, is paramount.

    Perhaps you should view some articles on the effects of concussion on athletes:-

    http://www.bcmj.org/article/current...agnosis-and-management-sports-clinical-review
    http://www.judobc.ca/files/2011/08/sportmedbc-concussion-workshop.pdf
    https://www.oapublishinglondon.com/article/566

    If you do just a little additional research you might just think again. But then again some folk will never believe the science.

    If you can direct me to any empirically based scientific papers that back your implied view that safety is not an issue in judo & such blows to the head are not overly injurious to the brain, I will gladly examine them with an open mind.

    Until such evidence is produced, I prefer to accept the prevalent view among neurological specialists over your opinion, however qualified, Moi.
     
  10. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    What I find strange that with all this medical information you still let your son partake of the same judo under the same orginization that you've stated on several occasions is condoning this behaviour.

    Think you might find that everyone here knows contact sports are dangerous, not just from one little tap but from repeated impacts and everyone realises that these sports present a slight risk but unless the artist gets really good then the risk is very small. The plus side is the fitness gained makes you far healthier than most

    You really do need to get off your high horse as they've already said no and from what's happened here everybody else denies your crusade as pointless and very possibly misguided to the point of libel against a minor?
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2015
  11. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    So you're just going to ignore the people on this thread who have agreed with the referee commission ruling that it wasn't a deliberate strike?
     
  12. inkpen

    inkpen Valued Member

    Seems like more on the thread view it as deliberate. I posted to stimulate a discussion-that is good. That's happening now
    A 9th Dan & 2 7th Dans have stated this was a deliberate strike to the face warranting immediate DQ. No sensei of 6th Dan or above status has backed the Ref Commission finding.
     
  13. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    Of course he is. It's why he's here. He needs to be right and will keep whining until somebody agrees with him.
     
  14. Aegis

    Aegis River Guardian Admin Supporter

    Guys, can I please remind you that even if you disagree with one another it's good to maintain civility.
     
  15. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    I'll get out from here but he's not a member he's here to push a cause that is all in his head. I feel used & abused :)
     
  16. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    I don't care about their grades. All that tells me is that they're old men with the commensurate eyesight.

    That people here also disagree should tell you that it is entirely possible that the referee commission was honest in its assessment of the incident. The kid finishes the motion with a lapel grip. Would need to be a particularly devious ten year old to manage that in the heat of competition.
     
  17. SWC Sifu Ben

    SWC Sifu Ben I am the law

    You really think someone taking a fall from a really clean throw, especially one where the thrower lands with them, doesn't generate a significant impact to the brain?

    You've become attached to a personal crusade. As others have pointed out your vendetta is very likely to go unsatisfied due to the size of the particular windmill at which you are tilting and the fact that they would see any admission as detracting from their image.

    Whether you are right or not about the strike being intentional let's focus on your broader goals here. As I understand it they are to promote safety in Judo and promote accountability for infractions. If you moved in the direction of championing those and away from trying to skewer a particular individual and organization people will be much more likely to support you both here and in public.

    If you can't do that and detatch yourself from trying to go after this one particular individual then yes, you are trying to "crucify" him.
     
  18. qazaqwe

    qazaqwe Valued Member

    If your kid was concussed after that, i really would wonder about his future in competitive judo, particularly if he comes across someone who's able to put him a few feet off the ground, especially given his requirement of an MRI.
     
  19. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    Where you get hit is as important in terms of causing concussion as how hard the blow was.
     
  20. qazaqwe

    qazaqwe Valued Member

    I know, but by the same token, landing on my head when training sambo a couple of times gave me a much worse concussion than anything i ever experienced when i boxed, and i never competed in sambo.
     
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