New interview with Kacem Zoughari

Discussion in 'Ninjutsu' started by Pankeeki, Feb 6, 2012.

  1. Fudo-shin

    Fudo-shin Valued Member

    Ha ha....I've got a droid and the spell check changes the words into whatever it wants it to be, I constantly have to go back and change things over and over.

    On your second point no more error in translation than I would say on the recent video of Hatsumi speaking about Ueno I guess, and I doubt it just due to the fact of the sheer number of those statements by various different translators over the period of years and in addition all I can say is MASAJI KIMURA, AKIMOTO, FUKUMOTO, not true students? Thats even if you buy into the hogwash of Sato and Ueno Sensei.

    Not to rant to much either but this is another thing that really ticks me off. IMHO, budo is not a study of linguistics, I am more than happy that my Japanese teacher speaks english. Mind you of course it would be alot better if I spoke Japanese when I am there, but it doesn't make my taijutsu one iota better. To many people believe that to have the deadly skills of a ninjer you have to read kanbun like its alphabet soup, I say bs you just have to have a real Japanese teacher you have a relationship with. I'me not saying speaking Japanese is a bad thing, just that some hide behind it like they have some uber powers in Ninpo when their taijutsu is just as lacking as the next. It does not make your taijutsu any better imho.

    Last there is a fine line between kyojitsu tenkan and being a flat out liar....the japanese have been dealing with gaijin long enough also to know how most of us think and sometimes no really means no and yes really means yes and there is no ulterior, mystic, cryptic meaning in their response and your just grasping for straws to believe what you want out of their answers, I guess it all depends on how close you are to said Japanese individual.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2012
  2. gapjumper

    gapjumper Intentionally left blank

    100% with you there.
     
  3. Pankeeki

    Pankeeki Valued Member

    I've heard Hatsumi sensei mention several times that Takamatsu sensei had many students.
    I also saw in a japanese newspaper that Takamatsu stated to a reporter in an interview that Hatsumi sensei was his sole successor and that if they wanted to learn from him they should go to train with Hatsumi sensei.

    So the question is, what was it exactly that Hatsumi sensei said, who was the translator, who was the audience?

    If anybody want to hear the story they can ask me over a glass of beer...
     
  4. Troy Wideman

    Troy Wideman Valued Member

    HI Big Will,

    I actually don't like to speak about these stories to much, because thats what they are, "stories" which we have to take on faith.

    However, the story was told by Takamatsu Sensei's wife supposedly that a famous karate man, "ueno" came to meet with Takamatsu. Takamatsu sensei asked her to get some tea and when she returned he was knocked out cold. Supposedly Takamatsu had challeged him sort of and knocked him out with a kick underneath the chin.

    There are other ones.


    Kind Regards,

    Troy Wideman
     
  5. hatsie

    hatsie Active Member Supporter

    Maybe we could get it on the Jeramy kyle show! Lol
     
  6. gapjumper

    gapjumper Intentionally left blank

    Very kind of you to buy the beer!

    LOL
     
  7. Fudo-shin

    Fudo-shin Valued Member

    No back in that time period, it was said not once but several times and in publications and I was actually at one of the events where the question was asked about Takamatsu Sensei's other students, the question was translated by Doron Navon and the response was something along the line that he (Hatsumi) was the only student of Takamatsu for the last 15 years of his life, which completely discounts others such as Fukumoto, Kimura, Moromochi, etc. Another pet peeve I have is all this malarky about noone being able to translate Hatsumi....now I am sure there is some truth to this sometimes, but my God, is everyone dumb? Over and over it seems people are just taking this excuse way out of proportion to have that it seems that Hatsumi is saying this or that just to fit their own political agenda.

    On your second point that would be nice to join your for a beer for the story, but perhaps if you were not willing to share it on here you shouldn't have mentioned it in the first place as that would be considered starting a rumor. Just like I could say their is an interesting little story as to a symbol on Hatsumi's Kotoh ryu scroll, or I could say about a story related to exactly why and where the other students of Takamatsu were when his funeral happened, and then turn around and say well join me for a beer and I'll tell you all about it....blah
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2012
  8. Pankeeki

    Pankeeki Valued Member

    Any time, any place...
     
  9. Pankeeki

    Pankeeki Valued Member

    I didn't mention it, I commented on a story that was posted by somebody else.

    In case of Hatsumi sensei it is important what he said exactly as he is difficult to translate for and there a lot of mistakes being made in translating for him even by people who have lived in Japan for a long time.
    Then there is the question of did he mean what he said: literally or figuratively
     
  10. Fudo-shin

    Fudo-shin Valued Member

    Sure....ok.....whatever you say :)
     
  11. gapjumper

    gapjumper Intentionally left blank

    This is a good point.

    In English, you could say "only student" with no emphasis and be understood that nobody else has EVER been their student.

    Emphasise "only" and you could be implying that he was the only student of worth.

    Emphasise "student" and you could imply that it was the only person you taught the real things to.


    So just in English, empasis and facial expression change so much...and that's without any translator in the middle.
     

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