Munich massacre

You're a fool.

You've been bending your arguement and the facts one way or another to fit your pre and ill conceived notions of weapons disarms.

You can go the gym all you want... if you're not in arms reach and someone has an automatic weapon trained on you... if they so choose... you're dead.

Simple as that.
So please stop trolling with your assnine assertions.

 

Please cast your votes:

A) Ate paint chips
B) Lived under powerlines
C) Parents played upsy-daisy but were easily distracted
D) All of the above

 

And I'm a fool? You didn't figure out that I'm talking about situations where the gun is in arms reach?

 

Yes. You are.
Stop attention whoring.

 

Well, you're the idiot who can't tell the difference between "arms reach" and "out of arms reach"...

 

riiiiiiight.
We're waiting for your vid of you doing your uber deadly automatic weapon disarms.... I mean come on... put your money where your mouth is... we'll wait.
Try not to leak blood on the carpet on the way in.

 

Ok since you're twisting my arm, if you're holding the AK I'm sure I could disarm you. There. Happy now?

 

This may have been pointed out before, but since Takeshi isn't actually a martial artist, maybe we shouldn't even bother reading his pointless opinions, let alone replying anymore...

 

I got a better question son. You ever held a gun? You've already admitted earlier to never being on either the shipping or receiving side of a firearm, and you're right and we're wrong when several of the members on this thread, including myself are proud gun owners. Now I'm sure if you wanted to sign a waiver releasing me or someone else of all responsibility (if its possible), some of us might be glad to hold a gun to the back of your neck for the sake of science.

10 bucks says you win the Darwin 2006 Award.

 

Alright.. its time..

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In Punishment, You Must:

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I'll be signing autographs at the door

 

Nice to know this debate is going so well.

Watching with keen interest that this gets back on track NOW.

Thank you...

 

Option E: He got taken hostage by a gunman, attempted a disarm and got shot in the head, causing irreversable brain damage. :bang:

Takeshi, yes, in theory there is a SLIM chance that a co-ordinated, planned and meticulously drilled attack by the hostages, combined with a hell of a lot of luck COULD have succeeded. I don't think anybody is really arguing that it is against the laws of physics that this could happen.

If you are trying to get people to admit that there was a good chance that the hostages would win, or that they had the advantage because they had big muscles or something...forget it.

They were in a situation where 8 gunmen who hated them and wanted to kill them (they WERE Jewish, after all) had guns trained on them. The price of failure is not an instructor correcting your stance and saying "Try again", it's an ignoble death by getting your brains and insides splattered across the room. No more family, no more friends, NO MORE LIFE.

Stop with the macho "I'd fight back!" talk just because you were shown a gun disarm, and be realistic. The effects of armed terrorists taking hostages is not something you can accurately replicate with a bit of krav maga. The effects are there to see - fight back and you die. Don't fight back and you die - in this particular instance. A lot of the time the hostages are released.

 

Ok, answer this:

1. If one hostage managed to knock out a terrorist and cut another, allowing one of the other hostages to escape, what would've happened if 6 hostages attacked simultaneously? Would things be worse? Better? The same?

2. If let's say four hostages escaped, what would happen to the other 7 hostages? The terrorists needed some for their plan.

 

3. WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IF T3E HOSTAGES WERE ALL BRUCE LEE?!?!?!?! T3H TERRORISTS WOULD BE T3H SUCK!

You can keep adding variables in until the hostages cannot fail to win, but that's not really the way to win the debate.

To answer point 1: If they didn't succeed, 6 hostages or more would be killed. The 2 terrorists who weren't engaged could easily let rip. Remember that these guys are ready to die for their cause. They do not follow military protocol or worry too much about possibly hitting allies.

To answer point 2: Then seven hostages would have died. Not sure what the point is here? If ten hostages had escaped, only one would have died.

 

I thought would the terrorists kill all the hostages immediately or try to finish the mission with what hostages they have?

 

Man go back and read your own thread. This has been answered already.
I'll try to break it down for you in no uncertain terms.

1) For the 6 hostages to attack simultaneously is asking a lot. Why? Because they were surprised. They were woken up and not all six hostages were in the same place at the same time at the beginning. Their mind was not weapons disarms as it is for someone in a Krav Maga class. Additionally we've yet to actually establish that any of them trained in Krav Maga to any extent. A simultaneous attack by the six would have required split second decision making and communication that was impossible given the circum stances. What were they supposed to do? Tap out Morse Code through the dormitory walls?!

2) Even had the six hostages attacked simultaneously it most probably would have only succeeded in getting them killed faster. Why? Because even if they all attacked - it's highly doubtful that all terrorists were within arms reach. Since the terrorists had every indication that they wouldn't get out of the ordeal alive they most likely wouldn't have second guessed firing into the melee and cutting everyone (other terrorist included) down like dogs. Given that we know the rate of fire per min. and sec. of the weapons they had even one terrorist out of arms reach could have easily mowed the room down. Failing that a single grenade (of which they also carried) would have blasted everyone to bits.

3) You continuously ignore the fear factor. Not only in being confronted with a live weapon at the hands of a terrorist that is familar to your culture and people... but also the fear factor of that era... Israel was fresh in from a whole heap of fighting with Arabs... the Bader Minhof gang was fresh in the memory and airline hi-jacking was coming into it's own. All factors not to be underestimated on the psyche of a hostage.

4) You sound like you don't understand much about terrorism. These terrorist were not afraid to die. They undertook their grim mission knowing full well that they probably wouldn't be coming back alive. Even if several hostage escaped it doesn't really change much. You still have hostages now being held by terrorists. Who are now angry because some of their hostages just got away. So that doesn't bode any better in any way shape or form for the hostages that are still being held. In many ways it's immaterial to your actual stance on disarms because it's not what happened. It's grasping at straws to support your assertions... which is nothing new in this thread.

 

Takeshi,

Can I ask what the point of this thread is please? Just curious.

 

Guy stuff, you wouldn't understand.

 

And this troll has lasted how many pages?


What a load of tripe.


What's the point of debating martial arts with someone who's never done any?



Go do some training Takeshi, and you might actually be able to comprehend what everybody else is talking about.