Ok, I'll bite on this.... I 100% - and I do mean 100% - guarantee you that I have had more fights than you. Does that mean my opinion trumps yours? If so then i will state it in a following post - if not then it is meaningless for you to bring it up in the first place. Tread carefully I will also guarantee that, coming from Manchester myself I will know which club you were bouncing at if you care to name it. Also if you give me a year and a time frame I can probably tell you who the manager of the club was and whether the incident was logged in accordance with correct procedures. Now again, be careful before you call me on this one because I am a lousy poker player - I never bluff. I have not experienced Systema, but have been around the block enough to know BS in a video when I see it. Remember also that I also have trained consistently with an extremely high ranked Russian Martial Arts coach, so again tread carefully. Balls now in your court Oh, and for the record, the plural of "anecdote" is not "evidence" The problem so far
You tread carefully boy! You were 12 when I was a door man working in a club called "Rebeccas" under whitbread 1985 Bury north Manchester he incident was not logged we did not do things like that then we kicked your ass and sent you home anecdotal evidence is high on the hierarchy of evidence actually! I have a good few years start on you I probably had more fights but look here pal I dont care at all about what you think you are! it is meaningless you just sound insecure extremely high ranked Russian Martial Arts coach? Who and why not name him? I think you are just on the wrong forum came off Bullshido did you? if you did I stop here I dont wast my time on internet arguments with no hoper's
Actually, no it isn't. Anecdotal evidence has almost no scientific merit whatsoever and if you look at most modern legal systems, anecdotal evidence on its own is rarely enough for any form of conviction because it is so unreliable. Rigorous testing in controlled conditions is always the highest form of evidence, following which would be statistical analysis of less controlled conditions, trying to strip out the effects of uncontrolled variables. Anecdotal evidence is pretty much 100% meaningless when it comes to analysis of data, unless it's specifically data on opinions (in which case there's still a lot of analysis done in a proper study to try to remove biases). Watch your attitude, please. People have been mostly asking very legitimate questions about your chosen art, and as far as I can see, you have been the one who has called what most other people train in "not worth doing in real life" and worse. Whilst MAP is much less forgiving of bullying of other members than bullshido, you will not be protected if you attack what others do compared to your own chose art, and try to back up your comments with bad videos and anecdotes.
Sorry to rehash an old argument guys but... If the Dog Brothers video (i.e. full contact fight with weapons involved) looks like MMA with weapons, that should tell you something. I don't know how many fights you've had in real life. But even if you've had a lot, your experience is limited and subjective. The quality of opponents you've been up against is probably not that high compared to MMA competition either. The main point of MMA in the first place was to shove such anecdotes and subjective judgements aside and see what really works in fight after fight after fight that we can all watch and learn from. Personal experience and taste just don't cut it anymore. The dichotomy you put between sport and self defence training is a false one. When the UFC began it was bare knuckle and hardly anything was illegal, yet still the sport fighters (who train with rules and safety equipment) came out on top. Why? Well, the truth is that we all train with rules for safety reasons. You do as well, unless you're telling me you eye gouge each other in class. And to an MMA fighter, it's better to spar realistically with limited techniques than to just learn a million techniques that are purely theoretical. How you train is more important than what you train. It's easy to say "oh well if an MMA guy attacked me I'd just do this this and this" but a lot more difficult to actually pull it off under pressure.
Systema1, Could you please give us a critique on the Dog Brothers clip? Give us a technical breakdown of what you feel is wrong with the system and why. You could also put forward where Systema deals with the problems you've highlighted and why it's more effective. Please note coming back with comments about peoples age and Vlad's ability is not an effective way of defending your position and it makes you look like someone who doesn't understand the discussion. To put it bluntly it makes you look daft.
The only problem with this is it in the first few UFC's it was striker vs grappler, so we didn't get to see mauy thai vs boxer vs kung fu vs ninjutsu vs systema........ mauy thai probably would have won the most fights, things have changed now and it wouldn't be the same, OK Jay if you think mauy thai is the best why don't you do that ? It's just not my cup of tea.
Striking vs grappling was one revelation, but sport vs "Street(TM)" was another. Sport strikers took on non-sport strikers and won.
Just read that and it reminded me of something a friend of mine said (some years ago) about Vladimir after a seminar that he gave "If he had been a postman, he would have been a GREAT postman" Some people are exceptional - for those of us who train hard week in week out and are still just one of many, that can be a bit of a let down
I meant the general competition format, should have been more clear. In any event non-sport strikers have failed to make an impact on MMA. You are correct in saying that no sport vs purely non-sport striker matches spring to mind in the UFC.
plenty of others there too Both of Scott Morris' fights and the Fred Ettish fight. Loads of kickboxers thai boxers and karate guys. Loads of strikers vs strikers and grapplers vs grapplers too.
The issue is that sports vs non sports UFC fighters haven't shown the methodology of the sport fighter is superior within the ring context, merely that those fighters were better prepared. And I'm not surprised, given how hard most sport fighters train compared to the average non-sport fighter. Note that I do conclude that within a ring context the sport fighter's method is better, just don't think this was a good illustration of that. A better illustration in my opinion would be an appeal to the authority of top ranking ring fighters, in who's best interest it is to find the most efficient way to fight in that context. When you are getting paid up to and in some cases over 100 thousand to win a fight, I would imagine you'd train in whatever it took to win. And given the amount of money involved, they'll have access to pretty much whatever they want to train in, within reason. Outside of the ring format... well it's a discussion that's been had many times, and isn't worth going into here. Suffice to conclude that a well trained MMA fighter is likely to be pretty effective at fighting under most contexts, especially compared to the untrained; and leave out the question of what methodology is 'best' within this topic! :hat:
Oh dear oh dear. You can't actually answer anything can you? Your only come backs are to try to have a dig at a persons age lmao has it occured to you that doing that type of thing is rather childish? So can you tells us the faults you saw in the Dog Brothers clip and how Systema would address them? Please try and engage in at least some form of intelligent discussion because so far most of what you have resorted to amounts to nothing more than school yard antics. Oh and whilst you are at it how about telling us why the chap in the Systema clips was flailing about like a loon when Mikhail hit him? I will accept that using "heavy hands" can be bloody painful but it wouldn't of created such an obviously over the top response from uke. If anything he'd of just doubled up and started wishing he'd stayed at home, not played silly buggers as if he'd been pulled by some invisible force. You have done nothing for your own credibility or the credibility of your art, in fact you've probably re-enforced a lot of peoples belief that the system is full of deluded crack pots. So much for the wisdom of age
The thing is though... isn't the issue the same? Surely if sports fighters are better prepared it's because of their methodology (i.e. tougher training and experience with hard/full contact)?
Erm...OK You do realise that I was just responding to samuraijay's post about early UFC's being all grappling vs striking (which they weren't) and citing the instances as early as ufc 2 where there were sport strikers vs 'trad' strikers (as he claimed this didn't happen until much later) don't you? I'm not really sure how your post relates to anything I've said.
Not to mention... what's funny about being 28? Is there a stereotype about 28 year olds that I'm not aware of? Condescension fail.
