Hi guys, I am wondering what others would know about/meanings the following words: * Redonda * Untol * Eskrido * Palakau * Ardigma * Abenico * Le Punte Abenico peace
Palakaw has just been covered in another thread. So I won't get into that one. Redonda basically just means "round." In my Doce Pares school (and I suspect you're asking about Doce Pares, as you mentioned Eskrido as well), it refers to a circular stick motion sometimes also referred to as sirkulo. In Modern Arnis, the same word refers to a particular six-count sinawali. Eskrido is the personal style of GM Ciriaco "Cacoy" Canete. From his experiences in eskrima, kodokan judo, karate, boxing, wrestling, aikido, and jiujutsu. It uses the stick to leverage takedowns and throws. The rest I'm going to leave for smarter people than I. Stuart EDIT: Oh, abaniko. Means "fan." It's a witik (flicking) movement in which the stick is propelled by a sharp wrist twist, so that the point of the stick traces a fan pattern in the air.
Thanks for you post. Can you direct me to the thread on Palakau please. What I know as the series called Eskrido, it is IMO Eskrima and Judo together, hence Eskri-do. Makes sense. Abenico is a 'fanning' movement Also forgot a word: Amara. I saw another thread on it, but what does it mean? peace
Amera is your fighting style. Doce Pares is unlike other eskrima sytems in that it has twirling. This can pehaps be described as like a golfers practice swing. It is movements done to educate your body and movement, not unlike shadow boxing. So when asked to show your amera (fighting style) you only show your twirling. Your Amera is unique to you and is developed from your twirling.
Cool. What Amara is to me is a series of striking patterns, like Kata. There are 7 and they have ascending in number of strikes. ie number 1 has 1 strike, number 2 has 2, number 3 has 3 etc. Is this similar to what you mean, in terms of 'shadow boxing' etc? And in terms of educating body movement? peace
Certainly in Doce Pares the Amera is a set of striking moves. The difference is without the twirling (slow practice movements) all you will ever be is a caveman with clubbing type movements. Twirling teaches me how to flow with my techniques, with one leading into another. From this comes my Amera. There are set Amera moves as you describe, but from these, my chosen Amera (fighting style/technique) is developed.
My definition of amarra comes from Inosanto Kali, as we didn't use the term in my Doce Pares school. It's derived from the Spanish word for 'weapon' ('arma'). And it refers to basic stick motions, from simple slashes to twirling, figure eights, etc. Slightly different meaning, but nothing unusual there. I can't find the discussion of palakaw, but I remember that one of the definitions given for it (and I can't remember the dialect from which it was derived) was "walk away." In our DP school, 'palakaw' referred to two different things. One footwork pattern (which involved circling away from an incoming opponent, unlike the more usual triangular footwork) and a sensitivity drill similar to hubud, but more circular. Stuart
Stuart, Would it be worth trying to build up an FMA terminology resource here on MAP? There is quite a comprehensive terminology resource for Aikido here, so something along those lines would be what I have in mind. I suspect you may have to have multiple entries per term, given the somewhat loose cohesion of terminology in FMA. The same questions on this subject kep on popping up!
Absolutely it would, yeah. I think I considered something like that when I was moderating this forum a couple of years back. But the challenge is that, unlike aikido, the mother tongue of FMA has lots of different dialects. And, though this may also happen in aikido, use of the same term varies dramatically from style to style or even group to group. That said, I'd love to see something like that done as a sticky. Perhaps with a citation to source, so we can have multiple definitions of the same terms, differentiated by their source (both style and specific teacher). You're right. The question(s) comes up a lot. Stuart
As far as I can tell Aikido (and probably most JMA like Karate and Judo) have benefited from a fairly stable post WW2 environment and a consistent language. Hence, the sometimes difficult concepts of Aikido are manageably explainable with terms like Taisabaki (body movement/alignment), Awase (blending), Shiho-nage (4 direction cut/throw) etc. Within the FMA world, where many, many divergent strands exist borowing from each other and other non-FMA arts, within a divergent linguistic environment and an extremly volatile political/social climate; its not too surprising that FMA has this terminology dilemma. Then on top of that you have the Filippino diaspora/immigrant factor to take into account e.g. Inosanto/Cabales and many others in the US. However, along the lines discussed, Im quite sure that yourself, ShootToDog, Pat, peter and others would gladly contribute to a worthwhile resource for all interested. Essentially what Im geting at, is attempting to bring some sense of structure to learning FMA, like we did a while back in a thread called something like 'Core Concepts' - which covered triangles, strike systems, hubud, positioning. I remember pat putting in some good input there.
Sorry but have to disagree, Armarra is a set of striking patterns much in the same way as a boxer builds up striking patters on the hook and jab pad, yes it is shadow boxing with the stick if you like, you are given a set of movements much like Jab, Cross, Hook, Upper Cut, or Double Jab, Hook Cross, Jab etc and from that you build your combination skills in striking, so yes in a way once you learn to free play it, it can be your fighting style so to speak, but like twirling it is not unique to Doce Pares, many systems have their own Armarra and many styles have twirling but when you show your Armarra you are not nessisarily showing your true fighting style and many Armarra do not show how you use your footwork in total or at your prefered range of fighting. Best regards Pat
I think it would be good but at the same time would add to the confusion, as our brother ap has pointed out, there are so many dialects and languages in the Philippines and then there are so many different interpretations of the same word from group to group it can be confusing to the majority, hence even a large proportion of FMA groups in the Philippines quite happily use English to describe things too. The main terminology I found in FMA in the Philippines was the 'You do like dis and I do like dat'. The FMA as a whole is not so tied up on terminologie in the same way as CMA or JMA but rather it is more about what you do as opposed to what you say that counts. Best regards Pat
I started that Core Concepts thread. Didn't seem like people were terribly into it, if memory serves. But maybe it doesn't. Anyway, I think this is a good idea, all the same.
Ive heard Palakau as 'to walk'. This relates (to me) as when we do the drill called Palakau, we are learning to spar, to use the techniques we have learnt in a flowing; combative situation. Thus, like a child; we are learning 'to walk'. I think as well that because of the numberous dialects that a FMA dictionary would be massive. I started this thread merely to get to see what the terms that I use in my training relate to. So far the info I have got has been interesting and valuable. I did come across something simliar once: http://pages.prodigy.net/david_wolfe/pmaa/ peace
Very true Pat. As I know Amara, it is done stationary with no footwork. Teaches angles of stikes, speed etc. Later on in my training thought, we started to apply it with movement, working high/low and various targets. peace
Redonda: As Stuart said, in Spanish this means "round". It is also the term in Modern Arnis for a six count sinawali involving circular strikes. Untol: means "bounce" or "rebound" in Cebuano.. in Tagalog "talbog" http://www.bohol.ph/diksyunaryo.php?sw=untol&lang=Cebuano&search=Search Eskrido: GM Cacoy Canete's system mixing Eskrima and techniques from Combat Judo, jujutsu and aikido. Palakaw: "Lakaw" in Cebuano means to "walk" or to leave. In Tagalog, "lakad" or "umalis". http://www.bohol.ph/diksyunaryo.php?sw=lakaw&lang=Cebuano&search=Search Ardigma: a contraction of "Arnis" and "Mandirigma" (warrior) Root word in Tagalog is "digmaan" meaning "war". Used by GM Nap Fernandez in his Yaw Yan system http://www.yaw-yan.com/about/ Abanico and Lapunti Abanico - As stated previously "abanico" means fan but can also be used to the refer to the flicking strike made by rotating the wrist, also called "witik" by some. Lapunti Arnis de Abanico is the style of the Caburnay family from Cebu. The term Lapunti comes from the following: http://www.visayanmartialarts.com/ondocaburnay.htm Hope this helps...
I do the same with my guys and I have heard the term used in many systems, the patterns may change but the principle is the same. Some even call it your 'Abecedario', meaning your basics which should be covered all the time as these are the back bone of all you do. And others may have a slightly different interpretation on that term. Like all things FMA it is open to interpretation depending on who you train with. Best regards Pat
We used the term 'abecedario' to describe these sort of fundamental steps. Your ABCs. Oh, and as Citom mentioned, 'witik' is a flicking strike. We actually fully referred to the abaniko as an 'abaniko witik.' A fanning flick. Though I can't really picture a variation on that move that didn't flick. So... Stuart
