What is the actual reason leg locks are banned in judo? I thought it was for safety, but other grappling arts seem to be able to practice them without this being an issue.
I've always wondered the same thing myself. Sambo and BJJ appear to manage leglocks without much problem. Perhaps too many people with too little skill attempted leglocks, which caused injuries in competitions.
Come on! Somebody answer this because I am really curious myself but do not know the answer. There must be a reason. I suppose Kano himself may give an explanation in his Judo book he wrote. At a guess I have 3 ideas: 1) That injuries to knees are harder to mend than those to elbows so the risk in practice is too great 2) Leg locks are too painful in practice? 3) That because Judo is a legacy of samurai ju-jitsu locking the leg is not seen as controlling enough because the opponents arms are free to e.g. draw a dagger and stab, eat a sandwich... dunno. someone enlighten me! john
Leg Locks were banned because of safety. Unlike locks on the elbow, locks on other joints were found to cause more serious injuries, more often, and to take longer to heal. A Leg Lock still survives in the Katame-No-Kata, Ashi-garami. They are only banned in Randori and Competition you may still be taught them in the curriculim of some Judo schools though. K
Before WW2, ashi gatame waza (leg locks) were legal and very commonly used. The knee casualty rate was allegedly phenomenal, due to some practicioners overly cranking in randori. If you have a look at some of the older books like, Mifune's "Canon Of Judo" you'll see that in the 1950's, when the book was published, they were still practicing leg locks and now illegal neck cranks even then. It was only after judo became a sport at the Tokyo Olympics that certain rules came in and that techniques were omitted. Before, judo randori was done from jigotai, now it's done head-to-head, shoulder-to-shoulder, like a couple of bulls fighting, pushing each other around.
This is all well and good until you consider that other grappling arts manage to retain their leglocks without guzillions of injuries.
Yeah, but not all grappling arts are in the Olympics. They need that shiny, whiter than white appearance to curry favour. And who said that they are not taught anymore? Those leglocks are still taught in judojo, if you know the right people.
Again, great posts. I'm just thinking the same with wrestling: Why doesn't Greco-Roman attack the lower body? Why doesn't Freestyle concentrate on attacking the upper body of an opponent? I guess Judo doesn't retain leg-locks, just "because"... (Lame answer, I know!) :Angel:
in training I have put on alot armbars and alot of knee bars or leg locks fortunatly i have never done somebody's arm but i have done a couple of knees on people. I think the reason it is banned in alot of randori is it comes on pretty quick an armbar you can fight a little bit (little little bit) but a knee bar, there seems to be a fine line between tap and snap. The people i have spoken to in the grappling field agree knee bars nasty nasty.
Greco-Roman has its focus on takedowns and pins. Submission is not even an important part of the curriculum (if presented at all).
Thanks for your reply. I guess what I was trying to say was more hypothetical, almost like trying to figure out why birds chirp, why snow is white, etc. I have trained in both Greco-Roman & Freestyle since my teens (in secondary school, there were wrestling try-outs, so I'd made the team based on my concurrent training in judo at the time), so I am aware of their content and differences. Arts remain different with varying focus on techniques "just because" is what I'd meant. I mean, why are you, you? Why is he, he? If they were all the same, then we wouldn't have different names for them. We should just accept things for what they are: some do this, others do that. That's all I'd meant. Sorry for the confusion. Osu...
I heared that Judo is from BJJ but it is inventor took out all the dangorous moves and put the safe moves in Judo is that right?
Judo originated from Japanese Jujutsu. Judo's founder (Kano, Jigoro) did take out many of the dangerous moves (mostly atemi-waza, although you could see them in the kata), just as you'd stated. BJJ originated from Judo & Japanese Jujutsu via Esai "Count Koma" Maeda, who taught the Gracie family out of appreciation for them helping him get settled in Brazil. Maeda was also a student of Kano.
leg locks, in all their forms are fully part of the Judo techniques- but obviously banned from sport (along with neck, spine cranks for similar reasons). The reason is that the potential injuries from leg locks (not ankle locks ) are severe and take a hell of a long time to heel- The fact is Sport Brazilian Ju Jitsu also banned leg locks for a long time- for the same reason. They only re introduced them about 10 years ago cos the Sambo guys who are leg lock masters had too much of an advantage in NHB fights- Ive have read reliably that there was a marked rise in injury rates and alot of old BJJ guys are not mad about them- but no ones gonna advertise these aspects. and like anything it comes down to training with sensible people and not taking silly risks.