learning more than one art

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by markshawn1, Jan 9, 2003.

  1. markshawn1

    markshawn1 New Member

    i've been studying tkd for a year now and as time has past i see alot of flaws.
    i love the art but it's alot of legs.
    maybe it's just i haven't gone far enough yet.
    i've been to turnaments and the hands are not used
    seems weird to me. because if i get in close i'm going to punch the mess out of you.
    is it true that all martial arts have thier flaws and combining two or more tends to balance better.

    ROBERT New Member

    TKD is mainly a striking art. You do tend to see more kicks during the turnaments although your instructer should be teaching you plenty of hand strikes as well. I am also a TKD practitioner.
    If you want to be more well rounded I would suggest a grappling art like ju jitsu or aikido or even hapkido. As the saying goes "If you can't fight on the ground, you can't fight!"
    As far as TKD turnements go, if that is what you train for you will only learn to score points. I would never limit myself to stiking only the chest or head in real life, therefore that is not how I train.

    Good luck in your training,
  3. pesilat

    pesilat Active Member

    It's true that all arts have flaws ... but the flaws (and strengths) will be different for each person.

    One art can contain everything needed for some people. Another art may contain everything needed by other people.

    The key is to find the tools that work best for you (wherever you can find them) and work those tools until they are reflexive.

  4. Blackbelt

    Blackbelt New Member

    Sounds to me that you may be in a dojang that is more sport oriented then combat oriented. There are some tkd clubs that work on all ranges and aspects of combat for realistic street defense. Good luck finding one though. I once thought that tkd sucked because it seemed to be unrealistic with all of the fancy kicks until I sparred with a tkd guy and got my ASSets handed to me! I later found out that he trained in a club that focused almost exclusively on combat applications of tkd techniques.:D
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2003
  5. KarateKid1975

    KarateKid1975 New Member

    Same with my new dojang, Blackbelt. I do Tae Kwon Do Moo Duk Kwan. We train strictly self defense. The option for tourny training is there, but not forced for those who want it. I did do WTF TKD, which was all sport. I didn't like it either. I did TSD before that (didn't leave by choice :( ) and that also was a whole lotta self defense training.
  6. TkdWarrior

    TkdWarrior Valued Member

    hmm KKid u changed ur dojo?
  7. KarateKid1975

    KarateKid1975 New Member

    Yea. Well, I still have to get out of the contract. My new school doesn't have the stupid contracts.

    ROBERT New Member

    HOW you train is equally or even more importent than WHAT you train.

  9. Labatt

    Labatt New Member

    There's a reason why TKD is well known.

    TKD primary focus, is the kick. Trust me, after 8 years, I know.

    The thing we emphasize, is that kicks have the greater potential of doing more damnage, in any fight. Your legs are several times stronger than your arms.

    I don't think I could Bench 800 pounds. Legs are lethal, they need to be taught how to be used lethaly. With 1 blow, if you get far enough, you could take care of someone.
  10. TkdWarrior

    TkdWarrior Valued Member

    cool news laurie
  11. pesilat

    pesilat Active Member

    That's one theory :)

    Personally, I like keeping my feet on the ground to move me around. I can and do kick ... but usually, it's low line kicks below the knee (on occasion to groin level). When I'm playing around in sparring, I'll occasionally throw high kicks ... but it's rare.

    Part of this is personal preference. I've always preferred to be in close range. Part of this is art preference. The primary arts that I train in are Filipino Kali and Indonesian Pentjak Silat ... both of which are very blade oriented and were developed in blade cultures. Kicking a bladed weapon out of someone's hand isn't impossible (there are people who can do it) ... but it's very risky. If you screw up, you run a *high* risk of getting your leg cut. If your leg is cut, depending on the area, you may have trouble standing on it ... much less fighting or, the ideal, running. Since my primary arts were developed in cultures where practically everyone carried (and still carries) a blade of some sort, kicking above the knee was a *very* low priority.

    But ... as the old saw goes ... "different strokes for different folks." :)
  12. Acekicken

    Acekicken Submission Fighter

    The Answer is Yes
  13. ROBERT

    ROBERT New Member

    Are you saying you can squat 800 pounds? That would be very impressive (and hard to believe). :eek:

    Agreed that legs are more powerfull than arms. They also take longer to reach an opponents upper body. The effect of a good kick IS substantially more damaging than a punch but also carries substantially more risk.(I am reffering to striking the upper body)

    Anyone who has watched a tkd point turnament has witnessed that even the more skilled practitioners of the sport are off balance 1/4 of the time. Usually falling or getting knocked down 1/2 as many times as scoring. This would be different if low kicks were allowed.

    I too am a long time tkd practitioner(12 years).

    If you train to do high kicks it is essential to also learn to fight on the ground.(there is a fair chance you will end up there) :D

    If you are training for turnaments then there is no need for a second art.

  14. markshawn1

    markshawn1 New Member

    i love tkd and enjoy the art. but it's just something i noticed when i watch sparring, both people get in close and the action stops on the street you would get killed. i just could not understand why they do that. i also see the same thing in tournaments when the rules say you can punch (weird).
    my boxing is getting better. and i'm learning how to balance both together.
    i talk to my instructor and he is in agreement with me learning both. i do not dislike the school it was just something i felt.
    which it seems like most of you agree.
    tkd as a sport is cool both i want to be well rounded, which means learning kicks as well as hands. grappling i will learn latter
    had my acl repaired and grappling scares me.
  15. pesilat

    pesilat Active Member

    Yup. As ROBERT pointed out, balance can also be an issue.

    A funny story. One of my instructors was taken to a TKD school (the head instructor was a friend of my instructor's wife and she wanted to introduce them to each other).

    They parked and headed into the building. My instructor said the parking lot was a solid sheet of ice and it was all he could do to make it into the school without falling and busting his butt on the stuff. They went into the school and my instructor began talking to the TKD instructor.

    The TKD instructor said, "You do that Silat stuff, right?"

    My instructor (MI): "Yes."

    TKD: "That's groundfighting, isn't it?"

    MI: "It's a lot more than that ... but there's groundfighting in it."

    TKD: "Groundfighting is a waste of time. I'll never go to the ground."

    MI: "That's not always a choice. Let's step out into the parking lot and you kick me."

    TKD: "I've got nothing to prove."

    MI: "Not saying you do. But if you can throw a kick on that ice out there and not land on your can, then I want to train with you."

    Needless to say, the TKD guy wouldn't take the challenge. He blustered and made some excuses and my instructor bid him farewell and left.

    Sad how some people can get so caught up in their fantasies.

  16. KarateKid1975

    KarateKid1975 New Member

    In that situation (me being a TKD person), I will NOT kick at all. Why didn't he just say that? That would have saved his ego, and your instructor would have agreed. Go figure LOL
  17. pesilat

    pesilat Active Member

    Yup. It's strange. The TKD guy let his ego get involved (even though my instructor didn't intend it as a personal challenge) ... and that, of course, changed the whole face of the discussion.

  18. TkdWarrior

    TkdWarrior Valued Member

    that proves that all TKD ppl r not **** head :D n he knew he can't kick on ice :D if he did he might be falling on his butts more often that not :D ;)

    this reminds me one of my training session with my teacher(1-1 session) we were in park n where we were practicing was very slippery, i was having probs while fighting him, so i asked him to change place he answered me(in hindi) "wat if u got stuck in slippery situation?"
    so for next hr we ended up practicing same place n knew lots about slipping :D
  19. pesilat

    pesilat Active Member

    Yup ... I'm a big advocate of environmental training. Specifically, train in any environment you regularly find yourself in. Then train in environments you don't frequent but might encounter.

    Mud, ice, snow, sand, hills, rain, moving water, standing water, dense woods, plowed field, cluttered room, confined space.

    Of course, some of these can be simulated for the sake of safety (like a cluttered room ... by using bags, pads, and other soft things, you can simulate the clutter without risking serious injury when you trip over the clutter).

    Unfortunately, we have no say in where we might have to defend ourselves.

  20. TkdWarrior

    TkdWarrior Valued Member

    yea environmental training(that's the word :D i forgot)...
    it's kinda odd for TKDist doing different sort of environmental training normally my teacher hav shown me different scenarios n position from where we hav to launch an attack n it's sucks big deal 9 out 10(may be 10 out 10) most of us got screwed first time... :(

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