Korean Acupuncture Charts & Point Names

Discussion in 'Kuk Sool' started by unknown-KJN, Aug 17, 2009.

  1. unknown-KJN

    unknown-KJN Banned Banned

    Despite the WKSA changing its stance from MANDATORY memorization of the acupuncture point names to merely RECOMMENDING that it be put to memory, it seems as though quite a few folks (here on MAP anyways) are highly interested in such stuff. So due to some discussion about it on another thread, as well as a few PMs asking (actually pleading) for me to share some information that was given out on the annual KSW seminars years ago, I had decided to go ahead and post this requested old info here on a new thread.

    Understand that I am no expert in the study of acupuncture, and I will not be discussing any type of treatment (medical or otherwise) for any malady. The purpose of this thread is to inform people about the NAMES of the acupoints in Korean, as almost all resources for the points and meridians used in acupuncture are in Chinese (including those with Romanized names, which typically use Pinyin Romanization - BTW a good pronunciation guide can be found here).

    After deciding to share this valuable info, I had intended to wait until I had the first chart ready to post before starting this thread. But the following post prompted me to get things started, even if a bit premature by my standards (and please be patient until I have sorted through all my material to eliminate any errors before I get around to the heart of the topic, that being the charts & acupoint names).
    Agreed, MunSan, the McCune-Reischauer system had developed quite a few problems (even if the bulk of the problems were due to laziness to transcript it properly). And I also know that habgido is an incorrect rendition of 합기도, but it is a common mistake made with the Revised Romanization of Korean (RRoK), especially for McC-R converts. Perhaps where I do disagree with you, is about the intuitiveness of the system. It does REQUIRE a pronunciation guide to properly emit the correct sounds regardless of how EASY it is to learn the system. The example you gave is classic, however, and an interesting bit of trivia is that EO, which is used to illustrate the Korean glyph ㅓ in the RRoK, stems from an old spelling for the nation's capital of Seoul (서울), and an erroneous interpretation of that older system where S=ㅅ, E=ㅓ, OU=ㅜ, L=ㄹ making it se-oul (not S=ㅅ, EO=ㅓ, U=ㅜ, L=ㄹ, as with the RRoK, thus making the word break as seo-ul). edit: This is what I read someplace but it's possible that the O in the older system might even reflect the NG glyph (ㅇ) which is written like an O and is used as a placeholder in Korean words which start with a vowel sound (rules dictate all words be written with a consonant at the beginning).

    But I really didn't want to delve too deeply into controversies surrounding the various Romanization systems or the fact that people oftentimes avoid learning these systems and merely sound out the words and use their own *make-shift* way of spelling (which is often inconsistent from instance to instance :bang: ).

    Having said all that, I do intend to list these points using the improvised system invented by WKSA (or whoever came up with it). It's not too different from the RRoK in how it handles the consonants, in that it uses G/K, B/P, D/T interchangeably for ㄱ,ㅂ,ㄷ (respectively) depending on its position within a word. The case of J or CH doesn't come into play since those two glyphs (ㅈ, ㅊ) usually take on a T sound when found in the final position. Again like the RRoK, assimilated sound changes are written using the converted sound, e.g. substituting NG for K (ㄱ) in the final position, whenever it's followed by M (ㅁ). And IMO these rules which are shared by RRoK, are indeed, intuitive. But RRoK stops there. This improvised system handles the vowels quite differently and in a manner keeping with an intuitive rendition for English speaking people.

    I will lay out what those differences are in a later post, as I want to finish up starting this thread so I can link it to another thread which has been hijacked by a digression over "proper" Romanization.


    Until then... :woo:
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2009
  2. unknown-KJN

    unknown-KJN Banned Banned

    Okay...

    RRoK starts out making sense, by using single letters for simple sounds. A, E, I, O, U, are all pronounced the same as in Spanish, and are used to represent ㅏ, ㅔ, ㅣ, ㅗ, ㅜ (respectively). But ㅜ is actually closer to the EU in French and therefore using a double-O makes more sense to me (think of the oo in look rather than the oo in moon). Spanish lacks a true short U sound (duh) and U is already taken, so e + o (EO) is used instead for ㅓ (which I already mentioned). The nondescript or unstressed vowel sound which is written in English using every single vowel (a in about, e in taken, i in pencil, o in lemon, u in circus, y in syringe) is typically represented in phonetics with the schwa (ə - an inverted E). Since the RRoK wanted to avoid phonetic symbols not readily depicted in ASCII, e + u (EU) was chosen for ㅡ (Korea's unstressed vowel and equivalent of the schwa). Most of the other vowel combinations make sense, simply combining the various letters already used except when a true diphthong is formed (e.g. WO is used instead of UEO for ㅝ, but in my opinion, using OE for ㅚ is confusing compared to the more logical alternative of using OI). ㅔ & ㅐ are pronounced almost identically by native Koreans nowadays, and perhaps that's why the latter glyph uses a + e (AE). But note that this combination is rare in english, with one or more letters usually separating the A & E to produce the sound (cf. MADE with MAID and you'll understand why Hyundai -rhymes with Sunday- elected to use a + i, instead of a + e).

    At any rate, a full listing can be found here.


    The improvised Romanization, invented for the Korean names of acupuncture points, uses TWO letters for all vowels, except where a diphthong or vowel combination requires more letters to accurately depict the sound.

    ah = ㅏ
    uh = ㅓ
    oh = ㅗ
    oo = ㅜ
    ee = ㅣ (but sometimes written with I, especially if a final consonant is present)
    ae = ㅐ
    ea = ㅔ (I have switched this to EH as it's more or less similar in pronunciation and definitely less confusing since anyone who is slightly dyslexic could easily get it mixed up with the previous combined vowel)

    That leaves ㅡ (not a hyphen but a horizontal stroke) which instead of using a schwa because it would be difficult to type as well as possibly confusing, uses either a bullet (•) or a mid-dot (·) and can even use a period (.) in a pinch.

    Vowel Combinations:
    yah = ㅑ
    yuh = ㅕ
    yoh = ㅛ
    yoo = ㅠ
    yae = ㅒ
    yeh = ㅖ
    wah = ㅘ
    wuh = ㅝ (sometimes written as WO)
    wae = ㅙ
    weh = ㅞ
    ui = ㅢ
    oi = ㅚ

    One last thing to note is that the EE sound of the Korean glyph ㅣ (a vertical stroke) is commonly said to mimmic the sound of I in machine. I tend to think of it as being I plus Y (IY), and when you combine this fact with the knowledge that the S sound in Korean is not made by hissing air through the teeth (as with English) but by hissing air past the tip of the tongue as it's held lightly against the roof of the mouth, you can then understand why Koreans pronounce words with S+I at the beginning more like SHI or SHEE. This fact is also reproduced in our improvised Romanization scheme, using SHI or SHEE to write such words.


    My Next Post = The Lung Meridian (I will also include translations of the point names)
     
  3. Pugil

    Pugil Seeker of truth

    You mean that you don't HAVE to sit and chant their names anymore?
     
  4. Ferran

    Ferran Valued Member

    Sorry to barge in, but if it's only for the meridian points and their names, "Essential Anatomy: For Healing and Martial Arts " by Marc Tedeschi has the charts and the names in Chinese, Korean, Japanese and English (translation of the Chinese one), plus the equivalent in Western medicine.

    For example:

    Spleen 12 (major ac-pt). Names: Chong Men [Surging Gate], Ch'ung Mu [Kr], Sho Mom [Jp]. Loc: In inguinal crease, lateral side of femoral artery, 3,5 units latera to CO-2, where pulse is felt. Anatomy, local: Point where femoral nerve traverses, femoral artery (on medial side).

    Keep well.
     
  5. KSW_123

    KSW_123 Valued Member

    This link comes courtesy of ImAJayHawk.

    //http://kmdoctor.com.ne.kr/acu/acu.htm

    Quite awesome resource really.
    Be nice if I could understand the Korean. But there is some english and lots and lots of pictures.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2009
  6. Pugil

    Pugil Seeker of truth

    Tedeschi's work is phenomenal and outstanding.

    His book entitled "Hapkido - Traditions • Philosophy • Technique' also includes the charts and names in Chinese, Korean and English. The book itself is also head and shoulders above most other books on Korean martial arts that I've seen.
     
  7. Out-to-Lunch

    Out-to-Lunch Valued Member

  8. ImaJayhawk

    ImaJayhawk Valued Member

    I still refer to that site sometimes. :cool:

    Btw you put the "http://" on the link twice.
     
  9. unknown-KJN

    unknown-KJN Banned Banned

    I want to say "Thank-You" to everyone who's posted so far, as now I can save myself the trouble of doing SO much work.



    :D ROFL - FWIW, I can still get through the first few meridians with relative ease.



    So how come you never shared it with me? No matter, I have it now.



    Thanks, Ferran. When someone contributes anything worthwhile, how could it possibly be interpreted as "barging in"? I was unaware of Tedeschi's book, and I guess I need to go out and get me a copy ASAP (perhaps the one mentioned by Pugil too) as it sure would be nice to have all that info together, side by side. But from what you posted, it looks like he's using McC-R for his Korean Romanization and that just sucks IMO (there's also a typo which I will assume is yours, Ferran, as SP-12 is chung mun, not chung mu).

    I had always thought that the definitive work for acupoint translations was Grasping the Wind by Ellis, Wiseman, & Boss. Although all references are to chinese, it does a fantastic job of explaining how the characters are written and also gives (several) alternate names for MANY of the points and delves into the meaning of each name as well as how possible mistranscriptions led to many of the variants in existence today.



    I noticed that he did that too. My guess is that he pasted it into the link bar not realizing that MAP prepends that bit (http://) for you. And I agree that this is an AWESOME resource for Korean acupuncture info. :cool:
     
  10. MunSan

    MunSan Valued Member

    True, a pronunciation guide is required for the RRoK. But this about Seoul is a very intriguing perspective! We don't need to continue stirring up controversy about this, but I thought that Occam's Razor applied here -- 'eo' and 'eu' are to 'ŏ' and 'ŭ' in Korean as 'oe' and 'ue' are to 'ö' and 'ü' in German. I just assumed it was the same concept; replacing a difficult-to-print letter with two. And in this case, the 'e' had to come before to avoid confusion with ㅚ, which is romanized as 'oe', and ㅢ, which is 'ui' but may accidentally be spelled 'ue' to match the style of the previous. Of course, I might be completely wrong and the history of the romanization may be as complicated as you claim it is. :hat:

    I thought that was ㅡ? As far as I know, ㅜ sounds exactly like the Spanish 'u.' Aren't the EU in French and 'oo' in 'look' pretty much like the English schwa? Either way, I like the KSW transliteration of ㅡ as a period, since the 극 in 극천 has the same unstressed vowel sound that one would naturally insert when pronouncing the letters 'gk' together, so a period seems a clever choice.

    Thank you for beginning this thread, by the way. And I'm a Tech student, not a Lubbock native, although I was born elsewhere in Texas. :cool:
     
  11. AirNick

    AirNick Valued Member

    I also have this book and couldn't recommend it enough
     
  12. Ferran

    Ferran Valued Member

    It might be a typo, but it's not mine. Chong Men in Chinese and Ch'ung Mu in Korean, according to page 65.

    I mentioned the book a couple years ago, when I first got it, but it's been a while --and I've stopped contributing as I used to--. It's a good reference book, but it's _mostly_ reference. Not much info beside this.

    Not having written for a while and commenting without a reintroduction is what prompted my "barging in" comentary. Thanks for not objecting.

    Keep well.
     
  13. Pugil

    Pugil Seeker of truth

    Ch'ung Mun

    According to Tedeschi's book Hapkido, which I mentioned before, SP 12 is Chong Men (Surging Gate) in Chinese and Ch'ung Mun in Korean.
     
  14. KSW_123

    KSW_123 Valued Member

    I hadn't thought of it, until you started this thread:)


    At one point I memorized all the pressure point names in Korean. I made tables for each meridean and wrote them all out by memory. I wanted to prove to myself that I could do it. I haven't studied meridean theory much since then, been too busy with other stuff.

    On the subject of romanization. I hate them all. I would rather just read/write the Korean. I wouldn't want to memorize the Chinese characters for all the points, but the Korean alphabet is pretty easy to learn.
     
  15. KSW_123

    KSW_123 Valued Member

    No two sources of point names seem to be the same. The book Grasping the Wind is probably the best at catalouging the various names of each point.


    The two accupuncurists I know don't even use the names, but instead Meridean + number.


    Even more frustating to me when I was learning these. No two charts seem to agree on the location of all points. For instance, one accupressure chart I have has the stomach meridean lateral to the nipple, when most of other charts have it passing through.
     
  16. unknown-KJN

    unknown-KJN Banned Banned

    Yup, that's why HANGEUL is informally referred to as "morning letters" (you can learn it in the morning and be using it by the afternoon). Of course, the Korean names for the acupoints are merely the korean pronunciation of the hanja characters.

    This is indeed the modern way to designate the points. The only problem with this method, lies with the two variant counting schemes for the (urinary) bladder meridian. One adds the outer line of 14 points alongside the spine after #40 (wee joong - located in the back of the knee - aka: ST-54) and the alternate method adds it after #35 (hoi yahng - located half an inch lateral to the tip of the coccyx). This offsets the counting scheme for all these points until reaching #55 (hahb yahng - located below the back of the knee). So unless you know which counting scheme is being used, any point from BL-36 through BL-54 without mention of the traditional name for the point, could have whoever you're talking to thinking of a different point entirely. BTW, the name of the first point on this outer line (whether numbering it as ST-36 or as ST-41) means "appended part."

    I've never noticed this quirk you mention, and find it rather odd since the traditional name for ST-17 (yoo joong - located in the center of the nipple) means "center of the breast" and is one of the few points designated as never to be used with needles or moxa (the reasons why should be obvious). Maybe since this point is never used for any acupuncture or moxibustion treatments, those erroneous charts you mention were merely being shy about illustrating the nipple? If so, then how did they portray the first point on either the Governing or Conception Vessels?

    I just checked with several different online acupuncture charts that I happen to know about and ALL of them accurately showed ST-17 to be located in the center of the nipple and mentioned that it's sole use is for locating other points on the chest, in addition to what I already said about no needles or moxa. So I'm really curious as to where you got those faulty charts. Wait a minute... I just realized that you said the chart in question was an acuPRESSURE chart, not an acuPUNCTURE chart. AFAIK, not only are needles & moxa off limits, but any significant pressure is also to be avoided on ST-17 (the subject might not object to cupping as long as you don't get the jar too hot, but this sort of treatment could easily destroy the doctor/patient relationship :evil: ).
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2009
  17. Yuhp Cha Ki

    Yuhp Cha Ki Valued Member

    But what if?

    But what if the person has saggy man breasts? Do the other pressure points head south too?:evil:
     
  18. Bruce W Sims

    Bruce W Sims Banned Banned

    I apologize in advance for a bit of nit-picking and hope my comment may contribute to accuracy.

    Technically, the matter of identifying meridians of energy as well as points where the flow of that energy might be effected falls under the heading of Traditional Chinese Medicine. One portion of influencing those meridians and their points is accomplished through motion, while another is through herbs and compounds and yet another is by external stimulus such as pressure, needling and heat. While the Koreans are known to have used acupuncture after the fashion of the greater Chinese practice, an "abridged" version focusing either on the hand or the foot was much more common. In this way, and not unlike the science of Reflexology, the hand (or foot) became a miniature representation of the entire body.

    The use of the larger TCM schema for identifying points has very little to do with Korean medicine, and very much was a way of identifying selected points to illiterate individuals whose culture had never developed the sort of physiological awareness as in, say, European studies. The use of the TCM points provides an extraoridinarily precise method for identifying a specific point to target in executing a technique. However, it is a myth that Koreans derived this either from their own medical pursuits or as an integral part of their military training. As with so many bits of Chinese practice, the martial use of TCM was adopted by the Koreans when its benefits were proven in training. FWIW.

    Best Wishes,

    Bruce
     
  19. Obewan

    Obewan "Hillbilly Jedi"

    IDK what Korean MAist you've been around but Grandmaster Suh is renouned for his knowledge of pressure points, accupressure, and accupuncture. I've witnessed several sessions of him performing accupuncture on individuals head to toe. If your saying that his knowledge is somewhat inferior to say a Chinese practictioner than you would have to prove it. Or did I miss your point?

    Was this before or after Korea's border took up a large portion of what is now China? Thoughts?
     
  20. VegasMichelle

    VegasMichelle Valued Member

    While it may be true that IHS has good knowledge of pressure points, acupressure and acupuncture....I would definitely NOT say he is reknown for it. He is known for his martial arts system, Kuk Sool Won...nothing else.

    To practice acupuncture in the US, IHS would need to be licensed. He is not listed by the national governing body, NCCAOM, nor by individual States....both California and Texas. Full, tenured professors of Oriental Medicine in Korea (SNU, Dongguk, KU, YU, KSU, etc) who go back to IHS's era (currently 70-80 years of age) do not remember him either. He has neither a current or an expired license of any kind on record. [Unlike the generic bio major or english major in the United States....the study of Oriental Medicine in Korea at the University level was VERY VERY difficult to get into. The classes were so small and so selective that everyone knew each other or heard of each other.]

    I suspect IHS is or was an average practictioner with or without a valid license.

    Contrast that to Dr Joo Bang Lee of HwaRangDo. He is known for his acupuncture AND is properly licensed in both Korea and California. I mention Dr Lee because IHS shouldn't be able to claim loss of documents through fire, earthquake, Korean War, etc...because other people his age can provide official licenses. Dr Lee, ironically, claims to have learned "secret" healing techniques from a monk...but when push comes to shove....the bottom line is: Dr Lee had formal Oriental Medicine training, has University transcripts, licenses...material he would need to gain official licensure in the State of California.

    I am pretty sure California didn't say, "sure, we'll take your word for it that you trained correctly with some monk in the hills for several years." LOL. No, I'm pretty sure California asked for transcripts and training license verification before giving Dr Lee the "all-clear" to practice oriental medicine in California.
     

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