How do you guys & gals teach or learn to defend against knives and other weapons? As far as I can tell, there are two methods: 1) Pre-arranged sequences. Attacker comes in with set attack, Defender responds with a set defence. Several variations are learnt and practiced. 2) Knife Sparring. One partner has a knife (a training one that won't cause real damage - maybe with red ink on the blade). He may use any and every technique in attacking, and the defender is unarmed but may do the same. I personally think the second method would be much more valuable. The students would also need some instruction in attacking with a knife, I guess. The first method above seems a lot more common in the martial arts though. Or are there other methods beyond these two? (Apart from a combination of the two).
i do both methods... in 2nd method we use plastic knife n the sparr full speed n even i got some nasty ones on my forearm to prove that it's hard to do it with plastic ones too, sometimes wonder wat'll happen if i hav to face real one chances with getting hit is pretty high or at least i havn't got that level of expertise yet... i would really like to listen Mr Mike casto on this... -TkdWarrior-
Knife Defences Break your training down into two sections; 1. Hold Ups / Threats 2. Actual Attacks Use a colour marker pen to indicate where you have been cut. Understand that you will get cut you are just trying to limit the damage done. Acut on the arm is better than across the face/throat. Practise with different ypes of edged weapons(not just knives). Any thing that can cut, tear or plung into you is an edged weapon whether or not it was designed for this purpose. Screwdrivers, broken tin cans, credit cards etc should be brought into your training. if you are just going to concentrate on knives think what sort of knife design it is. This will dictate the type of attack. Craft/Stanley knives will be used for slashing. also if the attacker is holding a knife in his right hand then you can be pretty sure a right handed attack will be coming. You can find a good article by a good friend of Mine liz Clark on the following link; http://www.geoffthompson.com/guest_writers/LizClarke/Guest_Writers_Liz_Clarke_page6.htm
Everything posted so far has been good. I think both methods mentioned in the previous post are needed. I'd also add some other methods. And it's a progressive thing. The elements can be mixed around some and taught in several orders, but the elements are: (will overlap previous posts) *) awareness training - should be taught early and reinforced often; I'll add some depth to this one at the end of this post 1) preset attacks/defenses, with mutliple defenses for each attack - this includes "scenario" training such as the "hold up/threats" and "actual attacks" that Stuart mentioned 2) random feed of attacks with the defender drawing from the "pool" of defenses according to what feels best at the time depending on his/her position and the relative position of the attacker 3) preset flow drills - these give high repetition of positions and help develop fluid and rapid handwork/footwork/body mechanics and ingrain good habits in a relatively short period of time 4) combining the flow drills - moving from one drill to another in a preset sequence 5) random combining of flow drills - moving from one drill to another at random 6) try to pull off techniques (from step 1 & 2) while doing the flow drills - this can be done at any of the 3 steps of flow drills and this takes a half step closer to sparring because you don't have a completely willing partner anymore; your partner is going to be trying to continue the drill while you try to get the technique 7) sparring Awareness training, I think, is the single most important element. If you're aware of your surroundings and of potential threats, then you'll have a distinct advantage if things get ugly. Awareness is a huge topic, but when related specifically to knives - or weapons in general - try to learn to be aware of body postures. Where are people's hands? Can I see that they don't have a weapon in either hand? Where are they likely to have a weapon concealed? Does their posture indicate that they may be about to draw a weapon? If you're in physical contact with them -whether fighting, escorting, restraining, etc. - feel for concealed weapons. Some things you can do are, before "empty hand" sparring, conceal one or more training weapons on yourself. During sparring, try to draw it and use it. Your sparring partner should not know that you have the weapon, but should always be aware of things he/she feels during the initial sparring. If they feel the weapon(s) then they should either try to remove them from the situation completely, pull them and use them themselves, take advantage of them - maybe causing you to sit down on the stick in your back pocket, or at least be aware of their position so they can try to prevent you from drawing them. Also, this element can be brought into the flow drill stages of development. You can put a training weapon somewhere, then connect with your partner (i.e.: maybe in a "clinch" position). Then play a game where you try to get to your weapon while your partner tries to prevent you reaching it and/or get it for him/herself. In your "scenario" training, as the attacker approaches the defender, he's empty handed, but may reach for a concealed weapon, or even have a small weapon concealed in his/her hand. The defender has to read the posture and possible threats, then work to nullify them. Personally I think all of these elements are important. I think they should be used in a progressive manner - though the order of some of the elements may differ from how I've put them. I don't think that sparring alone can fill the bill. Because in reality, a guy with a knife isn't likely to "spar." Most likely, you won't realize there's a blade involved until you're cut or stabbed. And if you do get lucky - or the attacker's primary intent is intimidation - and see the blade before you're bleeding, then the attacker isn't likely to try to use the same type of tactics/strategy that are used when two skilled practitioners spar. But I think sparring is a vital element. In fact, I personally, think that all the elements I listed are vital. I know of some people who feel differently about some of the elements. And that's fine. What they do seems to work for them. This list is what has worked for me and seems to make the most sense to me. Also, I think (and have at least implied) that all of this can be applied to any concealable weapon, not just knives. Mike
First of all if someone ever pulls a knife on you swallow your pride and run to live another day, but if you just cant swallow your pride then the second method is better in my opinion.
Running is always preferable to fighting. Ideally, using awareness and common sense, we can never have to make the choice between fight or flight to begin with. But ideal situations are rare. And the option of running isn't always available. Some examples: a) your back's against a wall and the only exit is through the attacker b) your friend's back is against the wall and the attacker is closing in c) a child (or someone else who can't defend themselves and can't run because they're held, paralyzed with fear, etc.) is about to be attacked There are other possible situations, too. I hope for the ideal. I train for reality. Mike
good posts... i think the two methods are pretty standard fare, but you can't neglect the first. In order to be able to attack randomly I think one has to have a good foothold on the technique needed. a fool can attack randomly and be totally ineffective.... we train both ways at my school, I gain something new from each experience that I can take to the "real world" i did want to say, don't get CUT!!! i saw someone say that "you're going to get cut, try to minimize the damage" o.k... but I don't want to get cut, fact is if your arm gets slashed you're going to drop your knife, you can smack the arm and make someone drop their weapon. Cutting tendons will definitely do the trick... i guess in the point that your arm is cut, your throat is not is good, jsut don't expect to take too many slashes or stabs from a knife and be able to continue fighting JOE
All thats been said so far is true, especially about awareness. On the street there will be no boundaries for your attacker, he'll just want to kill you, so of course you have to be aware. Just to change the topic a little, how many of you aside from me have ever been attacked by a guy with a knife? You can tell us the techniques you used.
Well, I didn't get "attacked" per se. I got threatened. The technique I used was to pull out my best poker face, look him flat in the eye, and tell him, with 100% sincerity, "Kid, all that knife means is that I get to kill you in self-defense." He wasn't really wanting a fight. He wanted to intimidate me. When I made it clear that I wasn't going to be intimidated and that, in my book, it was kill or be killed, he lost heart, said something lame, and left. Most of the reason that I was that gutsy was the fact that I had about 3 inches of denim (an ankle length denim duster) draped over my left arm that I could use as a shield and I was completely certain that I could prevent myself from taking any serious damage long enough to kill him if it came to it. So, while I really didn't want to fight, my comment wasn't bluff at all. Mike
Yes... I was, though I was not at all being aware of my surroundings at the time (exam stress..., this back in 1993). Teenager asked for my wallet ... I said no ... he stuck knife (which I hadn't seen to that point) into my arm - I woke up and punched him once, hard, in the nose - accompanied by a lovely cracking noise - he ran away. Not much of a story... I still have my wallet, but I also have a six inch scar in my left arm.
Most people will agree the first rule of self defence is awareness. Have you been involved in a knife attack Sean O?
