karate vs kickboxing & taekwondo

Discussion in 'Karate' started by macoda, Dec 13, 2004.

  1. macoda

    macoda New Member

    Hi MAPers,

    Yesterday I joined a karate competition,
    And there I had some karate opponents with diffrent backgrounds
    in relation to martial arts.

    The taekwondoka kicked hard,
    but staying close to this opponent and straight punches made me win the match quite easily. :D

    Next was a kickboxing opponent, the only way keeping my opponent from completely kicking my but was using maegeri mawashigeri gedan and straight punches on the face. :eek:

    Since in wado karate it is not allowed to make round punches, I didn't have a real answer to the tactics of the kickboxer and lost the match...... :bang:
    perhaps I should have made some more side steps????..... :eek:

    Does anyone have some advice what tactics are effective in kumite against other karate styles or other martial arts? :confused:

  2. Macoda,

    My primary training has always been Shotokan, but I have done Kick-boxing, Taekwondo and a bunch of other stuff too. The best technique I could muster against the kickboxers was a sharp snappy front kick to the chest. I found if I went to the stomach area I always got popped in the face with a jab, shortly followed by a hook punch.

    With the extension I got with the front kick, I could hold my distance enough to keep away from the punching, which as you say, I didn't have any real answer to. Once connecting with the front kick and knocking the opponents centre of gravity backwards over their rear heel, I generally went in with a volley of straight punches to the face coupled with sweeps and roundhouses to the lower legs, preferably the instep to pull the stance apart...

    ... all in all, pretty much what you said :D

    Side stepping didn't really do me much good apart from conditioning my face to impact. :eek:

  3. gedhab

    gedhab Valued Member

    Why not try tapping the guard of the kickboxer to allow some space to punch. I think side stepping would be a good idea. Also, it may be useful to be deceptive and use some feints to make the kickboxer drop his/her guard...thereby allowing you to have open spaces to strike. :)
  4. Ikken Hisatsu

    Ikken Hisatsu New Member

    out of interest, why is the hook not used in wado ryu? it is one of the staple punches for most stand up systems
  5. gedhab

    gedhab Valued Member

    i think its becaue Wado ryu is a linear system like most other karate systems and don't really use the hook....unfortunately :cry:
  6. AZeitung

    AZeitung The power of Grayskull

    When I took karate, they said it was because non-linear punches were too slow, which is rather odd, since we did round kicks.
  7. Hiroji

    Hiroji laugh often, love much

    The hook punch is used in Wado. You just have to look in the Kata.
  8. Alexander

    Alexander Possibly insane.

    Sweeps. If done fast and up close it is quite hard to see them coming.
  9. samuri-man

    samuri-man New Member

    well keep toey
  10. aml01_ph

    aml01_ph Urrgggh...

    Macoda, I think that both your timimg and distance are ruined by the kickboxers hooking punches. Since you are not used to this kind of technique, I think it would be better for you to confuse his distance with combinations. Starting out with the front kick is a good idea, but I think you should put some thrust into it. Also, you have to follow up the front kick with another technique depending on your distance (although a quick 1-2 punch combination works for me best). As a mental aid, just treat those hooking punches like you treat roundhouse kicks -- only much faster and delivered closer.

    All karate styles have hooking punches in their repertoire. I think the reason why hooking punches are relatively unknown to most karate styles is because they are not practiced often.
  11. Chruffin

    Chruffin Valued Member

    The difference between a roundhouse kick and a roundhouse punch is that the punch comes around in a hook action while in the kick your leg is brought up through the centre line as though you were doing a front kick and at the last moment you twist into a roundhouse.

    Saying that though, I've always been taught to use hook punches just like other hand strikes.
  12. macoda

    macoda New Member

    Many thanks Jamie,
    This looks like pretty good advice to me.... :)

    About the round punches, I saw some replyers referring to this,
    indeed we have round punches, in wado karate,.... :cool:
    but because we are not allowed to use them in
    kumite, we don't learn how to respond when our
    opponent uses them. :eek: What I want to add to this is,
    because we don't put a lot of power in making
    these punches to my opinion the effectivity of round punches is
    far more lower than the effectiviness kickboxers manage to get with these
    punches :cry:

    aml01_ph Is right, the kickboxer completely ruined my timing
    and distance, I have to take care to play my own game and
    not the game of my opponent next time.... :cool:

    Is there more, a karateka can do against a
    kickboxer in a kumite tournament? :confused:

    :D marinus
  13. CobraMaximus

    CobraMaximus Banned Banned

    The best one is when they throw a punch off the front hand you slide to the side and their whole torso is open to a knee, possibly roundhouse, punch or hito. The other good one is to keep moving a lot
  14. tommy

    tommy New Member

    In our style the mawashi-geri (roundhouse is executed differently).

    the knee is brought up at a 45 degree angle and then you are turning your hip over as you strike...this way you can go to the lower leg mid section or head with speed.
  15. aml01_ph

    aml01_ph Urrgggh...

    The good thing here is that karate, kickboxing are not entirely different technically. The only difference lies in technique execution, technique orientation and philiosophy, and of course the kind of training.

    The first thing you can inprove upon is your guard stance. Your hands should be closer and higher (protecting both your face and ribs) than what you may usually be used to in karate. Also, the slightly backward lean typically seen with TKD people and some karate people(to prepare for those knockout kicks), will restrict your options on both the number of weapons you can use and the ways you can use them.

    The other thing you should fix is the way you block. The common blocks in karate are often unwieldy (in my opinion) for the fast, dynamic pace of kumite tournaments. The best way to block against a kickboxer is to block like a boxer with minimal movement of the arms.

    The third thing you need to fix is the way you gauge your distance. You can do this and defend (to a degree) at the same time with a jab or the front kick.

    I know this sounds simple but it usually isn't. Everything above really depends on your timing and reaction time.
  16. Knight_Errant

    Knight_Errant Banned Banned

    That's as maybe. When I was sparring in wado, I was actually told off for using hooks. How useful can a technique be if you don't drill it and spar with it?
  17. gedhab

    gedhab Valued Member

    Hooks are not promoted from what i've experianced in Wado Ryu Karate. What Kata are you referring to that has a hook punch in it?
  18. Hiroji

    Hiroji laugh often, love much

    Naifanchi has the hook, upper cut and elbow. I agree however that these are not drilled enough in combos or alone, but that doesnt stop you doing them in your own time.
  19. gedhab

    gedhab Valued Member

    Naihanchi is one of the last katas you learn in Wado Ryu so you will have to have trained at least 4-5 years before you learn the hook...and its not a hook in the conventional sense. Its not drilled at all as most classes stick to the linear way of striking.
  20. Knight_Errant

    Knight_Errant Banned Banned

    You're exposed to naihanchi quite early actually, depending on the instructor.
    I think there's one in pinan 5, but I could be mistaken.

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