Judo vs. BJJ

Discussion in 'Judo' started by Xaiyn, Sep 14, 2005.

  1. TheMachine

    TheMachine Valued Member

    They are both effective. Judo in clinching and takedowns, BJJ in groundwork. For streetfighting, it would be best you cross-train in other arts.
  2. Freeform

    Freeform Fully operational War-Pig Supporter

    I think it's weird when people say that Judo is good for the clinch, because IMHO it's not really. Ok, it gives a great appreciation of an under/over hook and maybe side control, but because of the nature of the hold (Gi) it tends to mostly be fought at a range further away than clinch.
  3. republiksyawyan

    republiksyawyan New Member

    I study Judo,reason being,Im a striker.
    Judo teaches a striker how to take it to the ground hard and fast and finish via lock or choke.

    When people refer to Judo and the clinche any striker can go from a series of knees to a well placed hip toss or leg throw in a matter of seconds very easily,I guess this is when judo becomes more practical for some rather then others.

    If cross training is in mind make Judo your foundation and then outsource for knowldege on lower body subs.

    I hope this helped in some way.
  4. Kyouretsu

    Kyouretsu New Member

    Thankfully I started in a mixed club... judo and ju jitsu together. Now our club has gone to just ju jitsu... but we still have a ton of judo elements that we learn. When we are working on a throw... we learn judo style and ju jitsu style.
    We are blessed with a sensei who does his research. He searches out methods and movements that are from all sorts of martial arts and sports that will compliment our training.
    I think that is the key... if your sensei is really interested in teaching you the most he can... and truly teaching you self defense... you will learn elements of more than just your art. You will learn elements from many!

    BRECKDOG Valued Member

    If you picked two people out of 2 clubs with similar builds/ training time etc:

    For the street- Judo definetly,
    You can control the fight standing with the clinch/ balance skills and throw, if the fight hits the deck you have the positioning/ escape skills to prevail.
    The training and competition is fast and furious like a street fight.

    NOTE: I am not dissing BJJ here, I am training it now 2x a week minimum, and In a sport environment, with padded floor with long rounds you would have to go with bjj - as proven in many MMA competitions-
  6. Timmy Boy

    Timmy Boy Man on a Mission

    I'm gonna say BJJ simply because they do no-gi training (as far as I'm aware). IMO this is invaluable.
  7. Garibaldi

    Garibaldi Valued Member

    Judo is JJJ without the groundwork and leglocks
    BJJ is JJJ without the takedowns/throws and clinchwork

    (o.k that's probably a little black & white...but both have been watered down by the continuous development of the sporting element)

    Find a good MODERN jujitsu club, or a Judo club that has reintegrated the groundwork, or a BJJ club that knows a little more than a hip throw and a clinch & trip!

    Or what about Sambo?

    p.s Tommyboy - Whilst I agree that that no-gi work is invaluable, I wouldn't say it is anymore so than gi work. How many times have you ever seen a fight on a saturday night between two guys wearing rash vests and shorts? Whilst I appreaciate people wear t-shirts, don't neglect the gi work...it can be just as valuable to represent shirts and trousers...and don't forget that gi work also involves your antagonist taking hold of your clothes, not just you holding his. Have you ever tried taking someone down that is holding your jacket at arms length, or tried shrimping when someone is holding your jeans?
  8. Oversoul

    Oversoul Valued Member

    Hey! We have groundwork. And I believe BJJ has takedowns. I know you said you were generalizing, but groundwork IS important to a judoka (with the exception of the guys who referree my matches).
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2005
  9. Garibaldi

    Garibaldi Valued Member

    I know judo does...and I know its an important element to some judoka. BJJ does have takedowns, but they aren't integrated often into the competition environment because its not what wins the fight. Although I suppose pulling guard is a takedown of sorts :rolleyes: :D

    I personally enjoy training both Judo and BJJ, but I find it a little sad though when a BJJ stylist has to visit a judo club to learn any effective takedowns, because they can't get the techniques in their own BJJ class. After all, where did BJJ come from!?

    I am generalising as I know there are more and more judo clubs reintegrating the elements of groundwork that have been neglected.

    Your last comment reinforces the sad fact of the matter though...its the sporting element that destroys the art and removes the techniques. Referees don't allow groundwork so people don't train it.
  10. Timmy Boy

    Timmy Boy Man on a Mission

    I don't remember saying that gi work isn't useful. I just think that doing both is more versatile than doing just one.
  11. Garibaldi

    Garibaldi Valued Member

    Didn't say that you did dude, I was just making a comment about the validity of gi work and how I felt it was equally invaluable
  12. Oversoul

    Oversoul Valued Member

    I can't speak for judo in other regions, as I've only competed in Washington state and British Columbia. But around here, it seems that most referees stand the fight back up as soon as one fighter turtles (regardless of whether the other person might have been able to break past the turtle). With them, you have to literally land in a position where one fighter is pinned in order to have the match stay on the ground for more than three seconds. But there are a lot of more reasonable refs too. The standing up thing is one detail that I dislike about judo. I can understand not wanting the fight to be a boring one where it sits in a total stalemate the whole time, but if you go too far to the other end of the spectrum, you end up with fighters who, as you say, don't train groundwork at all because they can just let the ref save them if things go to the ground. It just too bad.
  13. republiksyawyan

    republiksyawyan New Member

    I had the wonderful opportunity of rolling with a bjj student today,and boy was it fun.
    Out of the three matches I submited him all three times via two anckle locks and one arm bar.

    Great sparring match but it was very noticable that with out the gi the bjj student which in my opinion was very good was defenitily out of his game. By not having a gi to grab onto it was very difficult for him to roll with me since Im used to rolling with out clothes grabbing.

    Mind you he made me work for ever lock and each match lasted about five minutes each,so I was sore and tired needless to say afterwards,but with a huge respect for bjj practitioners as this student (which is now after today a yawyan sibukan student) had great technique.

    Anyways I think either or is good but obviously I prefer Judo.
  14. JHughes

    JHughes New Member

    Judo vs BJJ

    Judo is a technicly sport so judo will have based more of thier techniques on playing against people on matts which means that thier way of fighting won't be based on street sort of stuff.
    remember BJJ is a street martial art which means it's going to be more advisable for street self defence :bang:
  15. Garibaldi

    Garibaldi Valued Member

    BJJ is as much as sport these days as Judo is. I think the days of the art being developed and progressed in the streets of Brazil are long over!!
  16. Scaramouch

    Scaramouch Lost Soul

    Remember though competitions are not everything. A small no. of elite judoka train solely to compete/win, a bigger proportion train to occasionally compete and probably the largest proportion don't compete at all. I have trained at several judo clubs over the years and all of them train groundwork, remember its a syllabus requirement so it has to be taught. Some coaches show a bias to a greater or lesser degree but you can just speak to them about it and you'll get their opinion and you can find a few coaches out there that make a career teaching it (like Neil Adams).

    The one g/w area IMO that is sometimes lacking in judo is being formerly taught transitioning or guard passing. You learn each pin and sub in a fairly isolated way as well as escapes and counters to them. However, in most judo clubs you're kind of left to figure how to link all this stuff together yourself through experience in ground randori.
  17. shootodog

    shootodog restless native

    i think that judo would've looked like bjj had there been no ban (imposed on macarthur on all japanese martial arts).

    yes. old school judo (aka kosen judo)

    it's the repetative training in judo some say. it conditions a judoka.

    great post liaorouxin!
  18. watto86

    watto86 Nah brah I'm not gone

    Although I think that it would come down to the person, not the art. Food for thought could be when Royce Gracie has been beaten by Judo practicioners?
    Having said that. I'm sure BJJ is equally as likely to be used to beat a Judoka.
  19. aml01_ph

    aml01_ph Urrgggh...

    What would come to mind probably would be that Royce is getting old and he's not as fit as he used to be.

    A judoka (I forget the name) actually published a book devoted exclusively to newaza (mat techniques). He wrote the book when he saw its potential after sustaining a shoulder injury.
  20. watto86

    watto86 Nah brah I'm not gone

    Hence why I explored the possibility of either style winning over the other. Thats why I also said it comes down to the person, not the style. I meant no disrespect. No need to get your back up mate.

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