Are there any of you JJJ, JJ or whatever the hell you call yourselves people that compete in BJJ tournaments? If you are one of these people, how do you find you fair against opponents that have much more specialized (I'm assuming) training than your own? Is there anything that gives you the edge/handicap? Just curious, don't hate the friendly neighborhood WC man.
Yes. And we do fine. Most people from a JJJ background that enter BJJ comps will have some idea of what they are doing on the floor and unless you are graded in BJJ too then you'll be fighting at white belt where the specialisation hardly makes any distinct advantage.
JJJ people who enter BJJ tournaments are probably from good schools that actually train correctly and put some emphasis on competition. I would assume their training isn't that much different than a BJJer's then.
Well said I've rolled with a few BJJ practioners lately. I rate them highly....good training if you ever get the chance to do it.
So I'm guessing JJJ schools vary a lot. If I were to take a JJ art, is there anything that JJJ offers me, either on or off the ground that BJJ doesn't? Or is the BJJ just too almighty?
I can't really see anything that JJJ would offer on the ground that BJJ wouldn't (that would actually work that is). There may be some bad JJJ schools that teach you something that isn't in the BJJ curriculum that isn't exactly a plausible technique.
What exactly are you looking for Rick? Asking the question you just did is like asking "is there anything that karate can teach me that kung fu can't?" There is a whole crapload of stuff JJJ has that bjj doesn't, but it depends exactly what you are after. If you can tell us that then we can help you.
I thought I was pretty specific in my previous questions. Primarily what I'm after would probably be the ground. Naturally that flows to ideas of BJJ but I'm interested in exactly what JJJ can offer on the ground since I've heard it can get quite good there. Hence I was after how JJJ guys would do in BJJ tournaments. Obviously it's hard to measure since it seems that they are only allowed to fight at the white belt level and must belt up in BJJ to compete at higher levels if I'm getting the right idea. All in all I think it's pretty much guaranteed that anything from JJJ that worked on the ground would probably has been picked up by BJJers by now anyway.
Well you said on or off the ground, which broadens things alot. If you are looking for ground, don't even bother with JJJ. I did it for 7 years, liked it, but if you want a specific skillset for the ground go to bjj.
I take JJJ. We go to BJJ tournaments and do pretty well. It depends on the student. My school has a Judo background, and we definitely do more throws than they do at the BJJ schools I've been to. We also do a lot of striking and self-defense. I am not sure how extensively BJJ cover throws, striking, and self defense. I have only visited a few schools (or they have visited us). There is a lot of variation in JJJ. I am not sure how much variation there is in BJJ.
There are open belt divisons in BJJ tournaments (and submission grappling tournaments) that JJJ guys could enter. I really would be quite surprised if I ever saw a JJJ guy competing with BJJ black belts or Submission Wrestling experts though.
But why not? If they've learned something different, or just used experimentation, they can come up with good stuff that fits BJJ rules. It could be fun to take on a BJJ black belt... (What am I saying... ) Nah, to be serious, I'd like to compete, my little BJJ might just give me a good enough grounding in the rules. I'd say what I've done in my JJ class forms more of my fighting style as a whole.
It's possible just not plausible that a JJJ guy who experimetns would come up with something that hasn't been done in BJJ tournaments already. BJJers experiment (yay gay jokes) all the time.
I would think it's possible, because I don't get that much formal groundwork training in JJJ, it's just finding more and more nasty ways to do things, and ingenious ways of escaping. Probably will have been found by a BJJ guy at some point, I would just hope it's not the one I woul be against!
There are plenty of things you can find from JJJ training that wouldn't have been done in BJJ tournaments already. Without getting into the old "eye gouge" argument, it doesn't restrict itself to a particular rule set as Sports BJJ does. There are plenty of things in JJJ that fall outside of the BJJ norm that can be used to set up attacks, finishes & sweeps. Finger locks is a simple example of this.
Ahh, interesting. So are you saying JJJers would actually start eye gouging and using small joint manipulation if they could on the ground?
Uhh, so how could they use these in BJJ tournaments if they can't be used in the rule sets of BJJ tournaments?
As has already been mentioned, "J"JJ generally varies way too much from school to school to really say anything concrete that stands to cover them all. I don't think anyone would argue that BJJ, on the whole, will offer better newaza training than alternatives. On the other hand, BJJ is also fairly known for many of its schools having weakness in tachiwaza (throws and so forth). If you are looking for options to crosstrain in, I would recommend choosing between BJJ and Judo, rather than BJJ and "J"JJ. Not because "J"JJ is a bad option, but because the other two are much more known quantities, which is important for those lacking experience. (Incidentally, Judo sort of rounds off the competitive gi-grappling skillset by generally being very strong with tachiwaza, though most schools still over plenty of newaza as well). But most importantly, I suggest trying whatever is available and simply picking the one you enjoy the most.
I didn't say it would be used in a tournament. You originally said about a JJJer "experimenting" would be unlikely to come up with anything that hadn't been used in a BJJ tournament before. All I meant was that by "experimenting" on the ground a JJJ will use other things they know where as a BJJ guy is likely only to experiment within the realms of the BJJ rules (which is what they know) Hardly likely that either will "experiment" whilst actually in a tournament (unless they are extremely confident!!) - I took your use of the word "experiment" to mean outside of competitive environment, and in a normal class or something like that.
