Japanese martial arts VS Chinese martial arts

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by JediKnight25, May 21, 2006.

  1. Bil Gee

    Bil Gee Thug

    I think the issue is not so much around personal attacks, after all this is the internet and nobody really knows you enough to get personal. It is the fact that you are talking absolute utter drivel almost every time you post. Your chi post is a prime example, the attempts at scientific explanations are so devoid of any signs of real science that I'm not even going to bother contradicting them, basically anyone who has ever studied life sciences even at a rudimentary level can see that you're talking complete crap.
  2. Davey Bones

    Davey Bones New Member

    :bang: :bang: :bang:

    Where can any of us begin? You've established you utter belief in the supremacy of Kung Fu. Obviously you've concluded based on God knows what that KF is the most superior style out there. And the best you can do when confronted with an obvious slaughter (Gracie v DeLucia) is shrug your shoulders and talk about "vitals and how excluding them is hurting a KF stylist's ability to compete"?!?!

    Dude, admit that KF isn't t3h roxxor. I do Kung Fu and know what its limits are and can be realistic about it (IE: most KF styles have no decent groundgame whatsoever). You seem to be living in Shangri La, it's the only explanation I can come up with for an alleged black sash making these claims...
    Last edited: May 26, 2006
  3. TigerKai

    TigerKai Valued Member

    go ahead and try to contradict them Bil :) This is very advanced anatomy/physiology, not typically discussed in a 7th grade life sciences class.
  4. Bil Gee

    Bil Gee Thug

    No, I'm not going engage you on your ATP energy theories, because frankly it's beneath me. I will point out that I've studied human anatomy, physiology, biochemistry, physiology and histology at degree level though.

    It really is time for you to take a reality check, go back and look at the thread, you've managed to draw criticism and derision from every person on this thread, which covers a very broad spectrum of outlooks. The possibilities are that we are all too stupid to understand you, or that you are wrong in almost everything that you post.
    Last edited: May 26, 2006
  5. TigerKai

    TigerKai Valued Member

    Heh, based on God knows what? I explained it is based on most kung fu containing chi and ging, yours obviously doesn't. I never said excluding vitals hurts a KF stylist's ability to compete. I gave high praise to BJJ in competition fighting earlier. There are very commercial schools that have KF artists mostly dancing around in forms using no real power or hard sparring. From the sound of it, many of you attend schools like this and cannot grasp what I am describing.

    I am a teacher of kung fu, at my studio and I teach kung fu classes at our local college. I cannot win an arguement against you because you counter with an insult to me and my background instead of having a real discussion. I have given you the information that will add so much more to your game, the pearls are there, why attack me?

    I know many are upset because I believe kung fu is the best and had bad things to say about other styles. This is just my opinion, your offensive retaliations should have no place in the discussion of chi and ging.

    In this entire discussion I haven't heard one person say, "no karate isn't like that, we don't fight like robots." Noone defended TKD either. All they have done is hurl insults.
    Last edited: May 26, 2006
  6. Bil Gee

    Bil Gee Thug

    You sent off a challenge to fight the Gracies a while back, and a local BJJ gym offered to take you up on that challenge as I remember. Go there, wipe the floor with them and then come back and we may start taking you seriously (don't forget to take a friend with a video camera). Alternatively, you've already stated in this thread that you could beat anyone who does any martial art other than Kung Fu, why not back that up by putting up details of where and when people can come to challenge you.
    Last edited: May 26, 2006
  7. TigerKai

    TigerKai Valued Member

    It's always good to know what you're talking about before you shoot your mouth off. I posted my studio address and offered my cell phone # to any that are interested. I sent the challenge to the Gracie site and no response other than some guys might contact me. None have. Someone said they probably wouldn't take up the offer until I am a ranked pro, which I understand.

    The studio is at:

    117 S. Columbus St.
    Lancaster, Ohio

    I am willing to put my money where my mouth is anytime. I met the local BJJ instructor with his top pro fighters and work out with them. I'm supposed to enter a cage fight in the fall. BJJ does dominate the octagon, I've never claimed otherwise. I also said Karate and TKD I can beat.
  8. Bil Gee

    Bil Gee Thug

    Can we have names of your BJJ instructor and the "top fighters" that you train with?
  9. Davey Bones

    Davey Bones New Member

    1. You have no idea what I train, do you? Let's clue you in: Praying Mantis, Shuai Jiao and Mongolian Grappling, 5 Animals, Bagua, Chin Na, and T'ai Chi. None of those styles involve prancing around, and they all involve hard sparring, power, and internal cultivation. Thanks for playing though, we've got some lovely parting gifts for you.

    2. Yes, you did comment on the vitals issue, I quoted you verbatim, above. But, just to remind you of what you said:
    That's a fairly obvious statement, "vital strike restriction allows BJJ fighters to dominate the octagon". Really, not much room for interpretation there, just the same excuses we've heard time and time again.

    3. You like to tell people who disagree with you they "don't understand". I understand you loud and clear. Your comments, quoted in my last post, speak volumes about what you're saying. We understand you quite well, most of us simply disagree with your assessments.

    Arrogance does not equal intelligence. Perhaps when you stop looking down your nose at everyone who disagrees with you, avoid glaringly obscene statements and generalizations which just about everyone posting in this thread recognizes as sweeping generalizations, we might take you more seriously. And enough with the "pearls before swine" already, it's becoming cliche. You haven't told anyone any great secret half of us haven't been exposed to.

    Dude, I'm a Kung Fu stylist and I found your sweeping generalizations and excuses as to why DeLucia got his ass kicked insulting. DeLucia didn't get his ass kicked because he was a poor 5 Animals Stylist, he got his ass kicked because he had no ground game. Not lack of vitals, not a restrictive ruleset, he got beaten by a better fighter with a better gameplan. And that just goes to show that even well-trained KFers are not unbeatable.

    That's because your commentary was, well, absolutely arrogant. Several people did comment on power generation and how a well-trained TKDer or Karateka or BJJer would fight. You just didn't listen long enough to hear it.
  10. TigerKai

    TigerKai Valued Member

    To Bil Gee and GangrelChilde:

    I'm sorry for snapping back at you guys in a rude way. I've enjoyed reading both of your posts many of of times. I'm frustrated because my ability and background have been dismissed as nothing. I'm also frustrated because you have attempted to devalue the worth of my posts with unrelated comments when there could be a MAP reader that it benefits immensely. I'm sorry for sounding cocky with my posts and I want to be open to your ideas as well.

    If we keep the posts up they way they have been this thread will dry out with pointless arguements and name calling. Instead, let's try to figure out the theories with other points of view and your own thoughts on chi and ging.
  11. Davey Bones

    Davey Bones New Member

    *sigh* I'm not deliberately trying to be dismissive, but you need to take it down a notch, SM. I'm not a huge fan of the "sweeping generalization". It makes you look like a nutrider, and I presume you're more intelligent than that.
  12. Skrom

    Skrom Banned Banned

    i'm curious too.
  13. TigerKai

    TigerKai Valued Member

    The fighters I only know on a first name basis. The jujitsu instructor's name is Vince Herman.

    These guys are new to me as well but they have an excellent ground game. We went at it for about an hour and a half switching on and off partners with a buzzer. My upper body was sore for three days, bruised biceps and forearms but I did alot better on groundwork than I expected to. They had problems finding the submission because I knew how to avoid it. We went non-stop in rolling the whole time and I tapped about 8 times.
    It was pretty fun and I learned more about MMA and BJJ. My specialty is stand-up, reaping, clinching and in-fighting. The only ground game I had going in was scissored rear naked chokes, sprawling, in-fighting to avoid the shoot, good balance and some basic olympic wrestling moves. I'm adding more of a ground game from working with these guys and preparing for that fall fight so I have more weapons than just being a hard striker. The only thing I said negatively about BJJ is that it is focused on winning MMA matches, which works for them. That does create some flaws for real fighting though.
    Last edited: May 27, 2006
  14. Sankaku-jime

    Sankaku-jime Banned Banned

  15. bassai

    bassai onwards and upwards ! Moderator Supporter

    *sigh* In this thread i'm afraid you've spouted just about every anti karate myth going and it does you no favours.
    I'll start with the above quote
    1/ I don't know what karate you've been watching but we certainly don't teach students to be rigid when they strike (in fact the opposite) your great revelation of ging sounds awfully similar to the concept of kime that we use in karate.

    2/ Where do you get the idea that we don't use body rotation? It's pretty fundamental to all karate.

    3/ Agreed the iron body isn't so prevalent in alot of karate , but , that doesn't mean it's non existant , makiwara training falls in this category i feel and my understanding is that at least some okinawan styles do body conditioning.

    Elsewhere in this thread you've trotted out the standard "but they fight in low stances and always draw their hand back to the hip" let me make this clear , i train in shotokan , allegedly the worst culprit of all for this and WE DON'T FIGHT LIKE THAT I'm sorry if this seema little ott but i'm getting sick of hearing this rubbish being spouted as fact all the time.
    People need to understand that what we do in kihon and kata is not identical we can get into that argument in more detail but for now i'll leave it at kihon and kata are training drills that teach kime and body rotation so that we can use them in kumite.
    This has been an exceptionaly long post for me so i'll leave it at that , but all i'm asking you is to look deeper at karate before you right it off as utterly inferior to kung fu :rolleyes:
  16. Sankaku-jime

    Sankaku-jime Banned Banned

    believe it or not I have deep respect for CMA, Japanese, Western arts etc. to say that CMA are superior to Japanese is just plain nonsense.

    i have heard these outlandish claims before from one of the local CMA Supremecists, i trained with this guy for 6 month and every lesson he bitched about all the other local Martial Arts Schools, i recall the phrase "that Japanese Crap" be used often.

    all this nonsense about CMA being superior to JMA just stems from insecurity and jealousy.
  17. SickDevildog

    SickDevildog Lost In The Sauce

  18. Davey Bones

    Davey Bones New Member

    You've caught the part where several well-known KFers here in MAP all joined in the bitchslapping of the lone nutrider, right? Bil, Dark Jester, Lohan, me, etc....

    We don't all share his views.


    Hey Sifu, you ever try going up against a Muay Thai fighter?
  20. Bil Gee

    Bil Gee Thug

    Having looked through all his posts I can only conclude that SM is a fake character created by someone who desperately wants a Kung Fu person to come on the forum and use all the flawed arguments that MMA nutriders have a set of standard answers to. It's been made quite clear by all the kung fu people on the forum that they think SM is talking crap. He's also made quite a few self contradictory statements.

    Sifu Morgan is a troll and a fake, and not a very good one at that.
    Last edited: May 27, 2006

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