is there a martial art based on an continuous flow of attack?

Discussion in 'Other Martial Arts Articles' started by starfruit, May 30, 2021.

  1. starfruit

    starfruit New Member

    like, is there a martial art where you're non-stop attacking and not letting the enemy do anything, leaving no window to attack for the enemy?
     
  2. YouKnowWho

    YouKnowWho Valued Member

    If you can throw

    - right jab,
    - left cross,
    - right hook,
    - left hook,
    - right uppercut,
    - left uppercut,
    - right overhand,
    - left overhand,
    - ...

    fast enough like a mad man, your opponent may not have change to punch back.
     
  3. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    A martial art with only offence and no defense would be a unrealistic and incomplete martial art.

    You need both offense and defense.

    My art, Choy Li Fut, teaches that most every move has both offensive and defensive applications. I would expect that to be true for other arts too, but I can't say for sure.

    All attacks, without the opponent being able to do anything, just means you are much more skilled/ powerful/ faster/ etc. than your opponent.
     
    axelb likes this.
  4. Mushroom

    Mushroom De-powered to come back better than before.

    Nate Marquart has entered the chat....
     
  5. Botta Dritta

    Botta Dritta Valued Member

    Uh...I'll play devil's advocate here even if I'm not a Krav Maga practitioner, but isn't KM methodology underlined with the concept of Retzef?

    Retzef – Constant, Continuous Attack | Urban Tactics Krav Maga

    Not saying its viable or the best way, but if there's a combat art that is built around that concept it might be KM.
     
  6. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Well-Known Member

    What is described sounds more like a particular strategy to me, rather than a whole system. It could be a dominant strategy within a particular system, but doubtful is the complete sum of the system itself.

    This can be found within any of a number of systems.
     
    dvcochran and aaradia like this.
  7. YouKnowWho

    YouKnowWho Valued Member

    It can be called as "seal the leak" strategy. You make a move, your move open yourself up. You then use next move to seal your leaking. When you keep doing this in fast speed, your opponent will be hard to find any opening to attack you.
     
    Flying Crane likes this.
  8. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Any martial art works like that, as long as your a lot better then the other person, of course if the only people in your chosen martial art are worse than you, your also not going to get any better.

    So it's a flawed principle to base all your training on.
     
  9. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Well-Known Member

    I think it’s important to be quite confident that the first strike is going to land before you launch into a overwhelming blitz strategy. Otherwise he is in a better position to defend and counter. If you get him reeling right away, better chance of success.
     
    Leo Nilo and Dead_pool like this.
  10. axelb

    axelb Master of Office Chair Fu

    If you're not attacking, then you are defending, or preparing to counter attack.

    No martial art has this as a primary training strategy. You will never go through your entire martial arts experience without having a training plan for see defence or counter offence.
     
    David Harrison and Dead_pool like this.
  11. YouKnowWho

    YouKnowWho Valued Member

    You don't have to start with defense or counter offense. You can start with 100% offense.

     
    Last edited: May 31, 2021
  12. Botta Dritta

    Botta Dritta Valued Member

    I think there is a difference between constant offensive pressure either as a situational tactic or a individuals preferred tactic, and a martial art that uses is as doctrine or a baseline from which all its technical actions stem from, which is why I proposed Krav Maga and 'Retzef' as an answer to the Op's question. God knows I have seen fencers who are 'tractors' who just 'step lunge attack, recover forward, close the line, lunge again, engage the blade in opposition replace point etc...' trying to deny their opponent space and time to breathe or formulate. But overall they become predictable and have to learn a Plan B when they come up against an opponent who is wise to that approach.

    In many ways many disenfranchised predators in self defence situations utilise this type of Blitz, after getting close and ambushing their victim with either a verbal script or a charm distraction. One RBSD instructor describes it to me as pure selfishness. "Its always my go". Tends to work less in sporting/duelling contests because the increased distance, space and lack of element of surprise mitigates it. Even in the video above there is a 'feeling out phase' and only a 0:6 when a strike connects and the opponent is genuinly rocked does the offensive pressure begin.

    It would help if the OP was a bit more specific with what is being asked or what they want it for? Is he a standoffish competitor who just wants to know ideas on constant offensive pressure from another martial art? Is he a Doorman who want to restrain someone as quickly as possible and not get in a fair exchange? Does he feel his current art does not provide this (albeit limited) approach? What exactly?

    EDIT: Also continuous flow(!?) of attack.
     
    axelb, David Harrison and aaradia like this.
  13. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    :rolleyes: You said that as a response to me, but that isn't what I said. I didn't talk about how to start only, I talked about the entirety of a style. Like I, and others, have said, continuous attack is a tactic, not an entire style.

    I might also add, that while it worked for Belfort in the clip you showed, his entire MMA record is 26-14-0. This attack style did not always work for him, and he DID use defensive moves in other fights.

    Moreover, I will wager that MMA fighters that protect their head will fare better in old age than the fighters who are known for just letting themselves get hit in attempts to be on the offense.

    I will say it again. Any style, if it even exists, that has only offense and no defense would be an incomplete and inefficient style.
     
    axelb and David Harrison like this.
  14. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    The question doesn't really make sense.

    The only way constantly attack anyone with any skill is to use footwork, positions and techniques that don't allow your opponent to attack... so it might look like constant attacking but all the defence is baked in to the attacks.

    True attack without defence would look like any unskilled bar fight where they windmill haymakers at each other.
     
    aaradia likes this.
  15. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    So hitting first, constant forward aggression, seizing, and maintaining, the initiative and the idea of "my go, my go, my go" (rather than your go, my go, your go) is very prevalent in reality based self defence and combatives.
    And generally it's a sound idea and seeks to instill the proper, pro-active and pre-emptive mindset needed to end a violent situation as quickly as possible. Don't wait to be hit. Get hitting!
    And actually that's exactly how many "street fighters" (ugh....hate that terms) "win" their fights (in reality they are assaults not fights). Overwhelming aggression and a barrage of attacks in a violent burst. It's basic but it can work.
    Where it falls down is that people don't just stand there and get hit (well some do of course). They fight back. They cover up, flinch, clinch, grab hold, pull your clothing, etc, etc . So if your constant flowing attack is interrupted by a smack in the chops you'll need to deal with that. If you get hit first you'll need to deal with that. You'll need to break grips, make space, break space down, move, dodge, etc.
    If your initial series of attacks fails then you are now in a "fight" and some measure of defence and countering your opponents attacks will come into play.

    It's something I've tried to point out to the Ninjutsu folk who prize being able to win a fight without the other person getting a chance.
    What if two people try to employ that strategy? Both can't be successful.
    What if a Krav Maga instructor bumps into a combatives instructor in a pub, they get into some verbals and both are looking to attack and not let the other guy get a chance? Someone's gonna be defending.

    Which is why you can see the "my go, your go" pace of sparring rather than "my go, my go, my go". Most people in combat sports would love to fight "my go, my go, my go" but that damned other person in the ring has other ideas and keeps fighting back! :)
     
    Botta Dritta and Dead_pool like this.
  16. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    There's a Billy Connolly bit where talks to an old Glaswegian about the how to win a fight.
    The secret, he's told is the old "one-three".
    What happened to "two"? Billy asks.
    "You get that one" he's told. :)
     
    Dead_pool likes this.
  17. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    This is a good point. You can do a jab/cross/back leg roundhouse/jab. Attack/attack/attack/attack. Pretty simple flowing continuous attacks.

    BUT...you can also do a jab (while moving your head offline)/cross (while level changing, moving your feet and slipping to the other side)/back leg roundhouse (while stepping off at an angle to their side so it comes in from a different angle, moving your head and "crunching" as you throw it, maintaining contact with your punching hand to occupy his hands/guard/eyes and then pivot off as you jab out on a different line/angle to the one you attacked from).

    Same combination as a simple jab/cross/back leg kick/jab but with a whole lot more nuance and defensive responsibility built in.
     
  18. IronMaiden1991

    IronMaiden1991 Active Member

    That's less an art and more a strategy to apply your art, though you'll find this idea in more striking arts than grappling by design.
     
  19. Tom bayley

    Tom bayley Valued Member

    In essence you are describing the first 7-8 seconds of a common form of violent assault - the Blitz attack. It relies as much on the victim being overloaded by physiological and psychological response as it does from technique. This is why many of the modern self defence systems place so much emphasis on surviving the immediate attack to give yourself time to gather yourself and then apply your martial arts training in defence.
     
    IronMaiden1991 likes this.
  20. YouKnowWho

    YouKnowWho Valued Member

    This is why you should use circular punches to knock down your opponent's straight punches like the anti-missile system. IMO, just to use arms to cover the head and play defense is not a good idea.

    So when your opponent non-stop attacks you, you also non-stop attack him at the same time. Your attack knock down your opponent's attack.
     

Share This Page