Is Tae Kwon Do actually "useless" against other styles?

We put significant emphasis on what part of the foot is used. Every kick has a proper foot positioning and we are strict about using it. My dojo uses English mostly so I can't oblige you on the Japanese term, but I can tell you we use the "knife edge foot position".

 

Many martial arts have been integrated im afraid i will need the Japanese term if I am to trace the history of when it was used

 

Tall order that..

You could...

1. try this: www.bestmediums.co.uk
2. research his old interviews via google (sorry, I`ve read them, so I`m not searching for them just for this thread).
3. hope that someone remembers what interviews he spoke of it in and posts them here.

That said, I was going to make the point Ap Oweyn made, but won't, as he has!

Speaking of changing his opinion... this was not the only thing he did it on.. over the years he changed his opinion on how much or how little influence Karate had on TKD.. one time it was 'alot', as the years rolled by, it became 'hardly any' or even 'none at all'.. all available via Combat magazine if you want to get back issues to check... from the 70's, 80's and 90's.


Stuart

 

You been repeatedly told to look above? Maybe thats so you don't "miss all the heavenly glory"

Seriously, I get what your saying.. but if only the people who lived it, (in your opinion) can really truely tell the real history... all history is possibly false!! And Im sure thats not the case! If you are a researcher as you say, you follow the leads and evidence.. even if it points in the directions you dont really like.. you are not doing that I`m afraid.

EVERY single TKD researcher I know, feels the same about TKD history as I posted here - its not just my conclusions, but there conclusions also and we have all arrived there, via our own research, as its only in the last couple of years we have shared views...

Stuart

 

alright we can leave it at that until I read up on them

 

If I gave you one, it would come from google, as my class uses mostly English. So I can't oblige you on that. Regardless of the origins of that foot positioning, we can all agree that it is now a part of karate. (Shorin ryu at least)

 

Just a quick note for the those discussing the 'knife edge' kick. in TKD, the foot sword as we know it, isnt the whole edge of the foot, but rather a small portion of it near the heal.. so is pretty close to being a heel kick anyway!

A lotta people don't know that

Stuart

 

What you say about history is true which is why when you study any part of history there a differing opinions like this one. Secondly as a researcher into the study of martial arts I look at both practical and documented evidence, which in the context of this debate would include the obvious similarities between taekwondo kicking and methodology of movement with Taekkyon as I have seen for when I ordered a dvd based on a Taekkyon association in Korea. I also apply logic to my research and what i'm saying here about Taekkyon's influence is comparable to suggesting that Capoeria has roots in particular West African styles of fighting; meaning that if you look and see obvious resemblance for example between Yoruba or Hausa fighting arts and know that there is a blatant geographical connection it may be fair to assume that the older style of fighting has given the newer one (in this case Capoeria) the particular features you have noted.

 

That maybe perhaps in your school but the knife edge that I was taught in the ITF was the entire edge of the foot excluding the toes that are bent backwards

 

Agree.

The ONLY reason for line work and the practice of patterns by everyone at the same time to the same beat and robotic type movement of Karate ( and hence TKD ) is because of its use in the military in the early 1900's.
Thats all thats about.
It needs to be scrapped.

To truly understand TKD you have to understand its origins ,through Karate back to its Chinese/Indonesion/Malaysian/ Hakka roots.

 

fair enough grasshopper

 

That sounds like a very fragile structure to me. The blade of the foot, it seems to me, is going to get riskier the further you get from the ankle.

Anyone else feel that way?

 

What about wearing certain shoes-footwear....can the blade be used whereas the ankle is fixed?

 

I might try it in a ski boot.

I don't know. What footwear would 1) support the ankle in that way and 2) still allow enough ankle flexibility to bring to blade into play in the first place?

 

Yes. I mistargetted a blade edge side kick on my Thai bag, landed towards my toes and sprained my ankle.

Same in Shidokan karate.

 

Yes because it has shotokan karate in it but there are blatant similarities in the kicks. Also in regards to movement the theory of power which includes the philosophy of movement is as old almost as taekwondo itself

 

No offence, but you have been taught incorrectly. Here is a pic from Gen Choi's book! Direct from the man himself!

Stuart

 

Which isn't that old.

 

Sure.. no worries. Im sure they would be available online somewhere or someone may be able to actually quote them, if they still have the magazines.

Sure... but if 20 opinions (through research) say one thing and one differs, especially the one from someoone who had the most to gain from it being different, I`d go with the numbers myself!!!

As Mitch says.. not compared to the 1955 version of TKD it doesnt! And, if you havnt read the interviews with Gen Choi over the years, you are missing a large part of any documented evidence anyway! Plus, I think the Taek-Kyon research people have already said it has no link with TKD - I could be wrong here, but sure I read that somewhere a few years back!

Not really, your logic is flawed, because you base one on research mainly and the other on words you have read mainly... I don't know enough about Capoeria to make the connection, but I`m sure its not just one guy claiming certain links, with lots of others saying "eh! that don't figure"! Saying something resembles something isnt logic... everytime I see a KK guy spin into a reverse turning type kick it looks similar to a capoeria kick.. but we both know they are not related. Your connecting Gen choi's words + korea and using the pretense of logic to claim that they are connected, when (again) if you compare them at the off-set (1955), you can quite clearly see they are not - surely early TKD, if it was based on Taek-Kyon would look similar to how Taek-Kyon looks now!!

You do know that originally, the Theory of Power DIDN'T include sine-wave, the part that many feel relates to Taek-Kyon, right? In fact, it had nothing to do with the movement phaze of TKD, just how to achieve power at the final part of a technique (according to the General).

Stuart