Is Aikido A Martial Art?

i wonder how hard it is to run away with a hakama on.

 

It's surprisingly easy. Stairs are a problem though.

 

Ok. I want you to consider this. Aikidoka don't generally wear armour or padding of any kind. There's no head gear, no gloves, no booties. Nothing. A gi and a hakama. That's it.

If you want to actually strike with full on conviction during a training session in that scenario. Be my guest. Make sure you make a video to share with the class.

In another thread I mentioned a demo I helped out at where the guy was waffling a load of crap. So I hit him and burst his lip. Here it is. Around 3:08. Now I'm not claiming this was a particularly good execution of the technique. But it doesn't have to be to cause damage.

http://youtu.be/whaa-txVqAg

 

I'm not sure what the relevance of that clip is.

Or, as Tina Turner would say:

"What's love [tap] got to do, got to do with it?"

I think the point that others have been making is; why not stick on some MMA gloves every once in a while and see what happens? Saying "we can't hit each other because we don't have the correct equipment" seems like a weird argument.

 

Does this not show that when you don't drill full speed attacks, when one actually comes at you, your timing is going to suck?

He knew exactly what you were going to do, and you still hit him.

 

I did like it when you tried to kick that kid in the face though (3'27").

 

Nicely done I thought!

Personally I would have slapped him in the mouth the moment he said at 0:59 "Aikido is set up so you can take on multiple attackers"

 

why not wear said gloves and headgear, it would at least make the defender have to deal with actual proper strikes and attacks rather than the extended unrealistic attacks seen in that clip?

 

To set up combination attacks and counters i.e. with changing and combined forces - to roll into the next salvo, this is essential - certainly to 'martial' TaiJiQuan and associated ICMA.

 

Back on topic Aikido is 90% striking. This makes it an effective martial art. So which art is most effective at teaching striking? Aikido, Karate, Boxing, Kung Fu or Muay Thai? Or more specifically does aikido come even close to any of the above?

EDIT Aikido does however teach you to hit very hard with sticks.

 

Context.

What is the purpose of atemi in Aikido, compared to those other arts?

 

Very true in my experience.

I like the idea of being more like a .50 cal machine gun than a one shot cannon in most situations. .50 cal also hits a lot harder than a sub-machine gun, so both power and speed are needed.

 

Aikido CAN BE as good if not better than most at learning how to strike on the move. Really don't know if every Aikido school is going focus on striking on the move though.

And what Dean said!!!

Also, non-Aikido video... Two examples of striking. One on the move (superman punch) and one using the legs/hips and torso twist/back primarily for power (shovel hook).

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NB6SZp5Lrfg"]Bas Rutten and dangerous punches - YouTube[/ame]

 

Help me out here, but atemi was used like three times in 50 variations, the rest being wrist locks/throws?

And people accuse me of simplifying Aikido into joint manipulation and throws...

 

The atemi is there, just almost no way to know this if not taught. Saito Sensei's atemi is when he puts his hands up and "hits" uke's arm. This is on entry. The idea is that Saito Sensei aligns his body to enter through an unbalance point and cut down uke. Uke's arm is in the way, so instead of taking uke's head off, Saito Sensei applies the technique given to him (Ikkyo/rolling arm bar, for example).

I know this isn't really easy to see as atemi, but it is a form of atemi on the move... only done really slowly.

The implicit atemi that could be done to soften up uke is not there, since it is only used as necessary... only if uke were to resist...

 

Ok, I understand what your saying.

These types of Atemi are of more relevance to the discussion:

http://aikidochoszczowka.pl/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/kanetsuka1.jpg

http://www.aikidotakemusu.org/sites/default/files/styles/c08/public/img/edito-06_05.jpg

Even the founder of Aikido applies it, yet it's virtually unseen in todays practice?

 

Yes many aikido sensei refer to blocking and blending movements as atemi but lets call a spade a spade. They are not striking techniques designed to disable or injure an opponent such as those found in Karate and Muay Thai. Even the hardest of such movements don't really hurt. I've had Hitohiro Saito blend/block one of my attacks and it hurt my forearm a tiny bit. To me the devastating part of the technique was the elbow dislocation at the end.

 

Your missing the point that Sensei was only showing Kihon in these videos and they are also just principles. Sensei initiates with a open handed strike to Uke's face to cause them to react, this reaction is used to apply a technique (This is a very basic lesson in Iwama) But its only a principle he is showing, its could be any attack to get a reaction, its up to the Martial artist to play with it and try different approaches, a Jab to the face, an upper cut, a kick, anything. This video is not showing many physical displays of striking this is very true but only people who have not studied closely with Sensei or his linage wonder why he is not showing all the strikes. There has been plenty of occasions all the atemi principle have been shown. But in these Videos Sensie is just showing the basic form its up to You to see what you can add into it..this is what O'sensie wanted.

For example in Shomen Uchi dai ikkyo Omote or Ura you strike to cause a reaction, then you strike as soon as they react in the ribs, the knees ect, instead of gripping the Elbows strong you can smash it ha hard as possible, when stepping through mash the knees, stand on Ukes feet so they cant move.

We learn the basic form of a technique, then start to bring it alive by seeing where you can add the Atemi principles.

You might not like or agree with Learning a Traditional Budo this way ... But tough don't learn it, go learn something else. Would learning Boxing, Mauy thai make you a better fighter, of course, but a striker should be able to learn the basic form then look at where their own striking abilities could be applied, yes it can take longer to learn but its not a sport or competition its a Budo and a long path

 

This....

The thread starts asking if Aikido is an MA then goes down the usual route of but it's not the best MA in the world ever so lets slag it off. Some of us train for FUN, I don't train to be the meanest guy wandering the wastelands, as long as no-one is deluded, enjoy yourselves.

Yes it's an MA, no it's not the best method to become a "fighter" get over it.

 

Sorry Phantom, I edited that last bit in case it came across to rude