India - The Home of the Martial Arts

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by Hindu Warrior, Mar 23, 2004.

  1. gedhab

    gedhab Valued Member

    why is this so hard to read and digest.....are you so opposed to that possibility? :rolleyes:
     
  2. Tseek Choi

    Tseek Choi Banned Banned

    I'm actually quite open minded to idea's.

    To say "All martial arts originate in India" really is total BS.

    What the hell were the rest of the human race doing while India was inventing martial arts?

    F'king pillow fighting!

    Surely all MA's were invented in East Africa, because that is supposedly the "cradle of Humanity".
     
  3. gedhab

    gedhab Valued Member

    it really all depends on what you classify as a MA.
    Hindu warrior provided alot of good info to support that argument.

    You just come along and say its BS without any evidence etc.....a bit pointless :rolleyes:
     
  4. Tseek Choi

    Tseek Choi Banned Banned

    I think the evidence that all martial arts did not originate in India is really quite simple.

    But to state that MA's originate in india is the most pigheaded ignorant insult to every other nation and people on the planet!

    Next you'll be saying that the Indians invented electricity, the internal combustion engine, the printing press, the telephone, the aeroplane, the train, the computer, chicken tikka masala, mobile phones, big brother, democratically elected government.

    The only good thing I can think of that ever came out of india was curry, and even that was improved on by the Chinese, malayasians, Thai & British.

    I think i've highjacked this thread enough now.
    You can all go back to pretending that you've made your mark on the world!!

    Oh yea, chickpea dahl. sorry I forgot that one!
     
  5. gedhab

    gedhab Valued Member

    Stop exaggerating, no one suggested this, stop making a useless argument, it holds no value.

    isnt this statement an insult:

    As if British food is great :rolleyes:

    What's your problem with india/indians...seems like you have a grudge?

    No one's pretending apart from you, listen to the facts and stop talking BS yourself!

    listen...do some research son......Dont be so ignorant :bang: :woo:

    and watch your typo's.....*sigh* :rolleyes:
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2004
  6. Pat OMalley

    Pat OMalley Valued Member

    Interesting reading, although mainly based on one countries opinion, History as they say is always written by the victor's, to get a true persepctive of something you need to look at the evidence and the facts combined with the opinion of both sides of the argument.

    We could also say that it was the European's that invented systemised martial arts as there is evidence that the European's and particularly the Celt's had training centres for combat skills taught by the Druid's no less, many of the instructors were in-fact women. (The catholic church later dubbed these women as witches because of their knowldge of combat skills and healing skills), the evidence for this goes back over 2000 years before any record of martial arts being taken to India, Also with the beleif that the Ayrian races invaded India (some for and some against this argument) could it not have been possible that the Ayrian brought martial training to India (Ayrian people were also closely related to the Celtic people, both are known as Indo-European.

    If this is so then we could say for all intence and purposes that Bruce Lee's Jeet Kune Do is in-fact European with a Chinese influence. Look at the facts with the trapping and straight blast from Wing Chun (Chinese) combined with the footwork based on European Fencing with the addition of Boxing (English) and Northern European Wrestling along with Savate (French) Europe could in fact lay claim to the art of Jeet Kune Do could it not. Just because the person who was Chinese adapted something does that make it Chinese:confused:

    In that same vent The European could also lay partial claim to other arts such as Filipino Martial Arts (the influence of European sword play), Muay Thai which admits to using English Boxing (you noticed I said English, that is because that is were today's boxing is supposed to have come from).

    And what about the Indian martial arts it's self, bearing in mind the British were in India for a very long time using military tactics (martial arts) to colonise the region, surley the indian martial artists of the day had to adapt their skills and even adopt some of the British skill in order to counter attack their opponents, or am I barking up the wrong tree here (I think not). So with this in mind we could say that the British are the precursors to the Indian arts of today. Using the same method of evidence that you wish to adopt to prove that Indian arts are the precursors of the oriental arts that is.

    Your evidence is somewhat subject to one persons personal opinion and that in it's self could be the correct opinion, but so could mine. To prove your point you need hard evidence, not historical theory I am affraid. We all like to think our nation has influenced the world in some way more than others, the true fact of the matter is that over millions of years all of the nations of the world cannot but help influence each other all the time.

    The Gulf is at this moment influence our mordern day martial skills as we speak be it in a good or bad way, that my freind is human nature.

    Nice article, but needs more hard evidence.;)

    Best regards

    Pat:)
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2004
  7. gedhab

    gedhab Valued Member

    Military tactics? They had guns and other military weapons...if they (the British colonials) were using hand to hand combat they would have been Annihilated :woo:
     
  8. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    Dude, you had me right up until you said this. Where's the evidence to support that?!
     
  9. Pat OMalley

    Pat OMalley Valued Member

    The British conquered many nations with the use of blade and hand for many hundereds of years before realising guns were more effective. The Indian resistance had guns too, and shooting a gun is a martial skill in it's self. The armies of today are our modern equivellant of the martial warrior of the past.

    In a thousand years time many may look back on them as ancient martial artists as we do the Samurai, The Warrior Monks of China, The Crusaders of Europe and the Moors of Arabia. They had Horse and sword and if the other side had them they too would have been annihilated:woo: :woo: :woo:

    Same argument, differnt time. Plus you need to read the whole thing, I was trying to make a point that no matter what subject you try to defend, there is always evidence to the contrary.
     
  10. Pat OMalley

    Pat OMalley Valued Member

    Also the ancesters of the British were the Ayrian and the Celt, so I could use this fact to try to win this argument, I was showing you that no matter what everything can be proven to be worng and on picking up on this one point you have proved the point I was trying to get across in the first place.

    Thanks guy's:p
     
  11. red_primate

    red_primate New Member

    Would this include capoeira? I don't remember India invaiding Latin America. Also, weren't many martial arts, including the weapons forms, derived as training techniques to ward off occupying or attacking forces? Capoeira an MA disgueised as dancing, TKD's high jump kicks to remove horse back riders, weapons that evolved from farm equipment, etc.

    Basically, if necessity begets a style, how can they all be tied back to India?
     
  12. Pat OMalley

    Pat OMalley Valued Member

    Exactley:woo:
     
  13. gedhab

    gedhab Valued Member

    What about when the British redcoats were defeated by the Zulu's ;)
     
  14. gedhab

    gedhab Valued Member

    Do you mean you agreed with what i said apart from this statement.

    Sorry, didnt mean to offend anyone.

    peace :)
     
  15. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    I agreed with much of it, yeah.

    None taken. Just try not to fall into the same trap you were arguing (fairly effectively) against.

    :)
     
  16. Martial7

    Martial7 Valued Member

    I would say that "Some" MAs may have come out of India, or maybe even a few that were originators of some Asian MAs but as far as all MAs? Its not possible. What Tseek Choi said has some merit to it as well, thanks Tseek im glad someone knows their history
     
  17. Pat OMalley

    Pat OMalley Valued Member

    My point exactley:cool:
     
  18. Matt_Bernius

    Matt_Bernius a student and a teacher

    Capoeria was a martial art that was disguised as dance. However high kicks were never used to take people off horses, and TKD, having been created in the forties/fifties wasn't geared to be used against riders. And while some farm implements were evolved into weapons, please note that this was not because anyone's swords were taken away. And some of the weapons associated with farming were infact never farm tools (Sai being the most obvious example).

    - Matt
     
  19. Zenn Ryusaki

    Zenn Ryusaki New Member

    I am actually glad to hear that, i thought of that myself, about "what the hell is the rest of the world doing" Because they say tea comes from India, and most of British actions comes from India, but i like to hear that not everything came from India for once

    ;)
     
  20. Thorstein

    Thorstein New Member

    nearly finished reading this........

    I spend like an hour of my life reading this!!!! :eek:
    But; it was very interesting... :)
     

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