I thought these days were over :(

Someone at my partner's work has just completed a 12 week self defense course and is encouraging others to attend.

Link below, I really have no words other than
Women's Self Defence - IWKA Wing Tjun coventry

 

Years ago, at a catholic hospital I worked security at, I was required to go to an SD training for all hospital staff.....given by a nun.
It was absolutely silly and mainly focused on getting away, while not hurting your attacker. And most of the applications taught, would not work

I will leave you with this. In order to take a violent person down (meaning someone in the detox or mental health ward, or the ER) you needed 5 people. one per leg, one per arm and one to cradle their head so you would not hurt them. I broke the rules one night when a pro-wrestler was brought in, who was on something and highly aggressive. He charged me like a bull, with his head down. My side step, trip him and his face plant seemed to work well at stopping him. I simply did not have 4 other people on hand at the time

 

I'mn the UK the goverment approved restraint system for mental hospitals is called "mapa" training, one on each limb, etc its designed to help restrain people without hurting them, when you have the required staff, its not that bad an approach, it also means safe staffing levels require that many staff.

But restraining people is a different thing to self defence.

I've done generic self defence/escape courses through work, and they're generally terrible.

 

I dunno, they don't claim to make the most elite deadly warriors ever, or any outlandish claims like that.

Is a twelve week self defense course as good as, say, four hours per week of striking and grappling continued indefinitely for your adult life? Of course not. But people willing to make that sort of investment in self defense, people like the folks on MAP, are not the target market.

If a class like this motivates someone to do something, anything, it's helpful in some (not all) situations. Maybe not when attacked by a violent predator ready to fight, but the majority of predators are instead acquaintances, and in many of those situations, fighting back and yelling may cause the perpetrator to stop even if they don't result in an MMA-worthy KO or submission.

The question in my mind is not whether it's as good training as martial arts enthusiasts seek out, but instead whether it's better than nothing, which is what the target market starts out with.

 

What, you mean that video wasn't for realz?

That's not what the marketing mentions at all though. It's all about walking home at night and being jumped by a stranger hiding behind a corner.

Better to not have any physical component and stick to things that will make a difference than build false confidence. Probably wouldn't be a sell-out course though...

 

I am generally not a fan of "Women's self defense courses" Although I have seen a couple, usually given by police departments in the USA. But the majority I have seen, or had explained to me, appear to be attempting to teach overly complicated SD moves in a few short hours, or making it unrealistic and not making it clear as to how violent things can get. If they keep it simple, and base it in reality, then they can be of benefit

 

It was bloody awful, most of the training for defense/escape the nun gave would either not work or get the person attempting it hurt. I liked the "How to get out of a choke hold" that had you pushing the person away so you would not get hurt and they would not get hurt. I did not become the nuns favorite when I said, "if I get out of that hold and have there arm, I'm riding that sucker all the way to the wall, I'm not giving him the chance to turn and attack me again". She did not like that, or me, after that.

I was never in an area, or an situation, where there was time to wait for folks to show up and generally there were not adequate staffing levels. Also, I was the guy they called when things went horribly wrong or when the police were bringing it someone in handcuffs. And upon seeing me show up, they would take off those cuffs, say you git it, and leave, which made for some rather interesting evenings, I do not care to relive. Especially when they brought someone in on a mental health warrant or you heroin addict in withdrawal.

 

The video is entitled fight back and shows a woman disabling a determined attacker with two strikes as he does nothing.

First the title bothers me because serious thought should be given to fighting back and escalating over just giving him your personal items.

Secondly does anyone thing a confrontation between a smaller weaker person and a bigger determined attacker is going down like that?

Then what bothers me is there other clips, only sparring clip is two women not using any type of gloves slapping at each other at a range that's unrealistic and not wing chun, the knife defence clip is someone running in waving the knife from.such a great distance you have time to back up and pick up.your own weapon.

Neither of those situations is realistic and could get you in serious danger in a real situation by breeding false confidence.

False confidence gets you killed it makes you try something when you aren't ready and aren't skilled enough but don't know any better.

 

The sad thing is how many martial arts clubs breed similar, misplaced confidence in physical skills (without covering awareness and avoidance).

 

So do people think there is a time and format for a short but intensive self defence course (for women or whoever) that IS worth doing?
Or is ongoing and regular training (with resistance and pressure testing/sparring, etc) the only thing that is truly worth the time?
If a short course is viable what would the format be and what would the course include? For how long? What's the shortest time you could run a course for and still get some good information and skills across?

 

What might be the most effective use of time in a SD course and what people want to pay money to do might not be one and the same.

See the quote about "I feel empowered" - my guess is that people want the same feel good vibe of invincibility that martial arts without pressure testing give people. Very few people want to pay for a dose of reality.

This feeds perfectly into the ego of instructors. Who wants to be stood next a white board talking about awareness and safety when they can demonstrate smacking the poop out of a compliant assistant and have a hall full of women think they're Jason Bourne?

 

Good instructors can take someone's natural reactions and quite quickly refine them to be more effective.

 

A very salient point. A sad point but what people want and what people need can be two different things entirely.

The thing is though I think adrenal exposure and pressure testing should be progressive and ongoing. Something training builds up to rather than something you are pitched into right away. As someone that got into martial arts because of fear and confidence issues I know I would have run a mile if I had to do scenarios and pressure testing early on. You could have people seeking self defence skills that have already been victims of crime and making them adrenalised could be utterly counterproductive and ultimately put them off if not very sensitively handled.

It seems to me we have a bit of an all or nothing response to self defence training. You're either doing it right (whatever that may be) or it's not worth doing it all.

Why does it have to be like that?

In some ways I see it like drowning. There are steps, advice, information and training people can do to avoid drowning.
But you don't have to become the next Micheal Phelps or jump straight in the ocean or even the deep end of the pool.
Learning basic safety around water, being switched on and aware and being able to doggy paddle in a pool is better than nothing.

What's the SD equivalent to that sort of level? And can it be taught in a short time?

Personally in a short SD course I'd cover stuff like aspects of awareness, confidence, target hardening, body language, adrenalin (how it manifests in attacker and victim rather than adrenal exposure per se), the law and what it allows and mindset. Stuff like that. I'd make sure that at the end everyone had the basic idea of the fence, deceptive dialogue, action triggers, pre-emptive striking and a pre-emptive strike they can make their own. They will have used that strike on pads with aggression and attitude in simple drills and scenarios.
Basic building blocks of a simple self defence strategic structure in essence.

I'd also make sure I provided links to further information and help that a short course can't cover. Things like info on the Suzi Lamplugh trust, Rape crisis and abuse helplines, how to spot an abusive relationship, sources of good information (Geoff Thompson, Lee Morrison, Iain Abernethy, Government and Legal links etc).

 

That's a very good point I'd not really thought about before. I mean...it's obvious now you point it out...and I try to be aware of what women go through (as far as I can) but I could see it being really patronising for an instructor to say "try to be aware of dodgy people in your vicinity"....and a woman thinking "yeah...I already do that all day every day?".

Although...I'm also sure many people (inc. women) think they are aware when they aren't or aren't aware of things they should be.

 

Oh and another thing...

who dat?

 

Building confidence in what though, her ability to defend herself, her ability to read a situation? Does it make someone confident to say no and fight back, to resist just enough to enrage the attacker?

It was my partner who broad this to my attention and she just thought it and other courses are nonsense because they neither give real skills or abilities and are at best misguided and at worst money making schemes.

I honestly think nothing is better than these courses as most women are already as you say somewhat aware of their surroundings and I'd honestly prefer them to be freighted and do as they are told than try something that might escalate the situation

Now if we are talking about a commited physical sexual assault then that's different but no short term course will help with that I'm sad to say, I'd rather they carried and trained to use a weapon of that was a serious concern.