Hung Gar

Discussion in 'Kung Fu' started by BklynJames, Mar 21, 2016.

  1. ned

    ned Valued Member

    Stealing a step - i.e closing distance . An application (amongst other things) ;
    hip throws ;

    [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_vOfbQqc3c"]Stealing Step - Shuai Jiao.US - YouTube[/ame]
     
  2. BklynJames

    BklynJames Kung Fu New Jack

    Yep, thats it. I call it the painmaker... Im able to get into it just not transition out very well. But ive been doing it for the last few days. Ive noticed this move is not for big people...
     
  3. Ben Gash CLF

    Ben Gash CLF Valued Member

    I'm 6'3" and 230lbs. Just do some squats.
     
  4. BklynJames

    BklynJames Kung Fu New Jack

    Im just about up there with ya.. 6'2" 210lbs.. Already doing the Horse stance, and transitioning into the other stances while staying as low as possible. I've learned new respect for the guys that train at Shaolin...
     
  5. Ben Gash CLF

    Ben Gash CLF Valued Member

    Ironically doing horse stance isn't great training for doing stances. Squats, lunges and stepups will get you better quicker.
     
  6. BklynJames

    BklynJames Kung Fu New Jack

    Understood, ill hop onto a training cycle to get a head start. Currently doing Yoga a few times a week and it helped the first day of class..
     
  7. The Iron Fist

    The Iron Fist Banned Banned

    Here's the problem with that brother, and I've seen this proven first hand. I have seen people who bench lift do squats, lunges, and stepups and all of that and more, not able to do a 1minute horse stance let alone a 5 minute horse stance having never practiced and I don't mean any old "horse" but the Great Horse forms. You could lay down whatever argument you like about the usefulness of the training either way, but it is an exercise that seems to be unique.

    I'd rather accept that squats, lunges, stepups, and stance training both static and dynamic all have their place and they all complement each other. The idea that a big time sink is important in stance training is a big misnomer. 5 minutes is always enough. I never bothered with more, really. But I don't think you can squat, lunge, or stepup your way to holding a Hung Gar Great Horse Stance for 5m. I've more than one cut, jacked brother attempt this and fail laughing and crying at the same time. And then they master the stance with a little dedicated practice. And it's no longer a big deal or some ancient secret. But it takes practice and it's a great lesson for training discipline isn't it? What's 5m a day, really, if it helps hit a 'spot' of isolated training. It's eccentric but so are most extreme forms of exercise. Maybe 10m if you're bored to hell!! :D But the idea that this training somehow will rob you of better training time? I don't believe that.

    I think most people unfamiliar with that form of stance training will be lucky to reach more than a few minutes for many months of practice, so we're really down to some 2-3 minutes per day, instead of 5 or 10m!!

    Personally, both sitting in and moving around in the Horse Stance(s) felt awesome as a form of exercise. I lost about 30 lbs doing that stuff and packed on some decent lower body muscle. I should really get off my butt and pick it back up soon.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2016
  8. The Iron Fist

    The Iron Fist Banned Banned

    My buddy passed me this, I hope this site is OK according to the link policy. It's kind of humorous but pretty on point.

    www.returnofkings.com/36872/the-physical-exercise-that-strengthens-the-mind
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2016
  9. BklynJames

    BklynJames Kung Fu New Jack

    So I actually tried it last night and almost made three minutes in a horse stance. Was it a perfect horse, Hell if I know. Starting from the heels I did 3 1/2 steps out and sat. But like I said, im sure the only reason I can do it is because of the Yoga I supplement my training with...
     
  10. icefield

    icefield Valued Member

    He said for doing stances, not holding stances, which goes back to the whole thread Tom started, if I want someone to be able to display power from a low position and be able to explode in and out of a stance, then the best way to train for that is loaded weighted movement going through those extreme ranges, which the Chinese knew hence the whole heavy weighted weapons practice, wearing weighted vests and iron rings thingy
    whether you can hold a horse stance foe a minute or 5 minutes has really no bearing on how well you can move in and through the stance and generate power out of it, it might be good mental training, it might weed out those that don’t want to really suffer for their art, but as an actual exercise for building strength its sub optimal and counterproductive as endurance and explosiveness are at differing ends of the muscular type envelope and the more you develop one the less you develop the other

    Now the positive effect of holding a low stance on the flexibility of a tight western person unused to sitting in a squat position and who has tight hip flexors and weak glutes is another matter
     
  11. Tom bayley

    Tom bayley Valued Member

    Hi BklynJames. Looks like you are in danger of getting advice overload. too many people giving you too much advice. At this point I would say that the post with the best possible advice on it was by Huoxingyang. Who if I can paraphrase said-

    "don't pay too much attention to us and what we post on this forum. As a beginner the only two people you should pay full attention to are your instructor and yourself."

    All martial arts regardless of the system are a Marathon not a sprint. You don't want to burn yourself out being over enthusiastic at the start. Your instructor will tell you the best way to progress at the begining. Trust them. By all means do other things like yoga, but do these other things for their own sake not to improve your kung fu. So Yoga for Yoga's sake. When it comes to the kung fu, ask your instructor what to do at home and how much to do of it. Then do what feels right to you.

    As this is a discussion forum there are many different people with may different agendas (small a). My agenda is that I like the similarities between arts more than the differences and I am a big fan of traditional Chinese arts, hung ga in particular, and I like chatting about them on the forum because it distracts me from the pain of migraines.

    Other people have different but totally legitimate agendas of thier own.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2016
  12. ned

    ned Valued Member



    Today MAP , tomorrow the world ( evil laugh !:evil:)





    Seriously though , I don't think anyone here has any ulterior motive other than to offer help or an opinion to someone who asks , no ?
     
  13. Tom bayley

    Tom bayley Valued Member

    ulterior motives no, I am sure that we all post in order offer help or an opinion to someone who asks. But this does not mean that we don't have agendas.

    We are all here because we choose to offer help and to share opinion, but we all have our own motivations for that choice. This is what I mean by agendas (small a). These motivations will shape our choice of what posts to offer help and opinion on and what we say in those posts.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2016
  14. Ben Gash CLF

    Ben Gash CLF Valued Member

    Thanks, saved me a post.
     
  15. BklynJames

    BklynJames Kung Fu New Jack

    Thank you everyone for your support. I've been in the MA world for over 15 years, 13 in Aikido and the rest in a few different styles of Japanese ma. This is my first dip into the Chinese world of MA. But after the first class last week it was a very big change from what im use to. Striking from the opposite side, blocks are different, Kicking is different. Then you have every stance being very low. These are all big differences than what Im use to. One of the things that really got me excited is the size of the curriculum. Its seems to be large and somewhat robust. Here's one question that I had but forgot to ask a few times. The five animal systems in Hung Gar. How involved are they? Are they each separate arts within Hung Gar? So I would be learning a Tiger curriculum, then move on to the next one?
    For the strength training im going to try and write down what we do at the beginning of class, if I can remember it and start there. I will definitely keep the yoga going as it really hits the core hard and some of the stances are pure yoga. So I will do it for the befits of yoga but also my new art of Kung Fu. Not sure if this will help me out but ill trhow some running into the mix here and there. My cardio and stamina from Aikido is pretty good (Traditional Dojo with no ac and very little heat). Tonight im signing up and ill report back tomorrow to let you know if I can walk or not. Wish me luck..!!
     
  16. Knee Rider

    Knee Rider Valued Member Supporter

    No offence intended to you (if you or your friend read or contribute to that site) but having had a browse, that website is pretty tragic. I find it's ideological perspective on women and the male identity, juvenile, insecure and wholey pathetic.:topic:
     
  17. huoxingyang

    huoxingyang Valued Member

    The Five Animals is just a concept and it's only really explored in one of the sets, aptly named the Five Animals Form (although it isn't even really called that in Chinese, and other lineages have a 10 Shapes Form otherwise known as 5 Animals 5 Elements). Other sets also explore some of the animals:
    Gung Gee/Taming the Tiger = Tiger
    Fu Hok/Tiger Crane = Tiger and Crane
    Tit Sin/Iron Wire = Dragon

    I wouldn't think too much of Hung Gar as a "5 Animals" system or an animal style in the sense of animal imitation. The animals are more conceptual in nature, although the Tiger motif is the most prevalent I find - they do say that Hung Gar started out as a Tiger style before the Crane and then other animals were added.
     
  18. BklynJames

    BklynJames Kung Fu New Jack

    Thank you huoxingyang for that explanation. That's what I originally thought but wasn't sure. So its the five animal concept (Using your terminology), and we do have the five elements also. My friend who has been training for many years was describing it all to me and that and the animal stuff stood out the most. Prob what I can relate to. One thing I did notice in class was the instructor breaking down the body for us. Head is glass, torso is stone, and legs are lumber. In order to break the stone you must smash the glass then break the stone. You see I am remembering a decent portion of the class..
     
  19. icefield

    icefield Valued Member

    To paraphrase a well known coach, any Moran can make you feel pain and be sick, it's takes someone with real knowledge to make you faster stronger and better conditioned...
     
  20. BklynJames

    BklynJames Kung Fu New Jack

    So I signed up last night and took class. Which was an enlightening experience. We did low stances for a straight 20-25 minutes without coming up. At which point I asked to be excused to run to the bathroom and proceed to throw up. Then right back onto the floor to continue training. At which point we started doing drills. I now have a good idea of the conditioning I will be doing at home. Everything they did last night! The senior student who taught last night was very big on conditioning and explained to me after class that in order to have the power you need to be strong at a low stance. Which I can only agree with. Last night I saw more similarities to Aikido where we moved off the line. But instead of going behind to redirect we followed up with a few punches. The one thing that stuck with me from the first class is when the teacher explained the Head is glass, the torso is stone and the legs are lumber. So you smash the glass and then break the stone. It sounds to me like an effective plan...
     

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