Headspins, round off flash kicks, handstands, maccacos, b-twists, corkscrews, arabians, etc. These will not help whatsoever in a fight. I wouldn't count a hook kick or crescent kick as acrobatic, and those are used like crazy in Capoeira.
I feel like it's definitely taking the acrobatics to another level. I'm not trying to bash on Capoeira or anything, because I love the art.
*shrug* As far as I'm concerned, acrobatics are the least interesting part anyway. Once you've seen one backflip, you've seen them all. And they're by no means a prerequisite for having an interesting game: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSYUOQu8KTw"]CAPOEIRA ANGOLA / Tatiana e M. Camaleão (2004 - RJ) - YouTube[/ame]
Oh I can get what you mean by not needing flips for an interesting game. That's where Capoeira is much different than tricking. But saying that one backflip is like all others is a little pretentious, style is a big factor in tricking. Every tricker has there own brand. But to a non-tricker, I can understand saying everything looks similar. It's just how serious you take it.
This is the crux of the matter for me. Let me say in advance that I mean no disrespect to the trickers, their athleticism and acrobatic ability is obvious. But I don't see why I should be any more interested in it than I am in gymnastics? Lets take another example, musical patterns. Here we see the use of movements designed for self defence stripped of their context and repeated as a series of poses in a dance routine. They may require strength, agility, timing and a host of other attributes but they are no more martial than doing the tango. The same applies to tricking. There is no martial application; the emphasis is on acrobatic ability, which is in itself a noble end. Again though, it is no more martial than rhythmic gymnastics. As such it is not another style, nor, IMO, part of MAP, other than as an occasionally diverting sideline. Mitch
Man, Capoeira looks like the absolute last martial art I would ever want to study to learn self defense. The only people I know who do it partake in it for the fitness/mobility aspect and I've never heard of anyone practicing it to learn how to fight. I'm not saying it doesn't look hard, that it's not challenging or whatever, it just doesn't look practical in any situation other then in a Capoeira gym. Am I missing something here? Do I need to find somebody who is good in Capoeira and spar with them to be pleasantly surprised? I'm not trying to troll or anything, I just really can't watch a video like the above posted one and say to myself, "wow, I could really use that in a self defense situation, or to feel more confident in my fighting ability." All I see is, "wow, that would really help me with body control and flexibility. It could really improve on my practical martial arts."
I will agree that it is not a martial art. But I feel like it does have a home here because of it's roots in martial arts and sport karate. And whether or not you find it more interesting than gymnastics is pure preference. But if you ask any gymnast if they thought a 1080back flip off of one leg was possible ten years ago, they would have laughed in your face. Or doing a half-in back-out from a cartwheel set up. Check out this video for example: http://youtu.be/mld_cxu0qhk?t=2m48s Tricking keeps re-inventing the way acrobats use momentum. Or at least, toying with it more than ever before.
I think if you practiced tricking in a way that hurdled yourself at your opponent doing one of the "tricks" that it could potentially be really devastating if you land it. It could have moves like the "flailing salmon" or "tenacious tilapia." Sometimes I see cool tricks when I watch the video from the OP, sometimes I see a flailing fish from guys doing the same exact thing over and over. Regardless, whipping your body at somebody in an explosive manner and landing (no matter what part of you hit them) would probably hurt a lot. : P
This any better? [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQV2cxKxvz0"]Capoeira Topazio Capo-Jitsu - YouTube[/ame]
The little dude at the end kicked butt with that cartwheel! Yes and no as far as helping me get a better respect for it. What it looked like at some parts was wrestling concealed in a dance, or TKD concealed in a dance. To me the whole dance part seems a bit unnecessary to be honest. You can fake or deceive just as easily with throwing a feint or bob and weaving. I'm not saying I don't think it's impressive, I just think it adds too much that isn't necessary as far as a martial art goes and that's completely personal opinion. I'll have to look into it a bit more to get a better opinion.
I'm sorry. It's my fault more then anything. There isn't a forum for it and I didn't want to create what would probably be seen as another "your martial art is stupid!" thread in general topics.
I think you're right. But as you've already stated, it's not a martial art. And this is Martial Arts Planet. I'm sure this is true, but it also defines precisely why it shouldn't have a forum on a martial arts website. The skills which are being developed are acrobatic, the reason for the development is not martial. Mitch
We can leave this here, I suppose I'm trying to explain why there isn't a forum for it. I hope you enjoy your training though Mitch
Ohhh alright, yeah I can get that. I didn't want there to be one anyway, us trickers have forums already!
Mitch had to tell the Morris Dancers the same thing. Glad they have their own forums. Those guys are scary!
Ticking has made its way into the martial arts in the form of "XMA", even though the original intent of "XMA" was to provide and outlet for creative martial art forms. By and large the Ticking community has grown in the realm of b-boy/girl dancing, parkour, and XMA. I am a huge proponent of XMA/Tricking, though I do not do it personally. It gives the younger generation a chance to express themselves in the martial arts though creative forms and weapons routines. The biggest argument I hear from a lot of those who are against is that it is not "real" martial arts or it is not "practical" martial arts. To them I say you are correct. It was never meant to be. It was developed for competition and demonstration only. I have not heard any real experience martial artists, who also do tricking, say that it is practical defense. However, keep this in mind. If I can spin fast enough to execute a 540 or 720 kick, then couldn't be conceivable that I could execute a fast spinning back kick that only requires 180 degree turn? So if you are tricking in the martial arts, more power to you. It is great entertainment in my opinoin. Just remember that if you are a martial artist who tricks, be sure that you are grounded in basics and do not forget to practice your basics. I have seen great trickers do lousy martial arts and I have seen great martial artists who have done crappy tricking, but when you get the best of both worlds, its like watching a live kung fu move.
I absolutely hate it, because whenever I mention an interest in martial arts, I'm asked to do a flip. I can't do a flip, I can defend myself damn you!
