yes but they are directed at Hoshin and Jen, in fairness to Dave and his dojo it would be courtious to move it as its not bujinkan.
Yep, might be a good idea. Move this one as well. Just out of interest are grades being offered in this Ryu? ie actual grading?
Will do. I beg to differ on that: As you can see Scott did get the "go ahead" as it were! Anyway I'm splitting this off for now then getting a global mod to move it to the weapons forum. Edit: Turns out I can move it
No-one said you were. However, the techniques of Hyoho Niten Ichi Ryu belong to the school, and if you copy those techniques and teaching them (offering grades or not) you are misrepresenting the school, whether you use the name or not. Musashi's school is Niten Ichi Ryu, and if you teach his techniques, guess what you're teaching? Questions: a) Where did Kyoshi Glimme learn these techniques? From a video as previously mentioned? From a genuine teacher? b) Does Kyoshi Glimme have a teaching licence from the Tenshin Shoden Katori Shinto Ryu? WHere did he learn those techniques? c) What is Kyoshi Glimme a Kyoshi in?
Also, Who has Kyoshi Glimme being learning Tenshin Shoden Katori Shinto-ryu from? a.) The mainline (i.e. the Otake dojo) b.) Sugino line c.) Sugawara How long has he being learning it before being given "permission"?
Hi, Joe, Scott clearly thinks his Ryu owns all the kata Musashi ever wrote in any variation and has such a bee under his bonnet he is still failing to see the implications of such a precident. Just let him froth a bit and calm down and maybe we can get a rational discussion on what makes something the intellectual property of an individual Ryu. Scott, I trust you are going to behave in a gentlemanly manner and stop embarrassing your Ryu by your liablous statements against Ed-san and Hoshin. It's not up to lesser lifeforms like us what our Ryus put out. I certainly don't have any influence on what Hoshin put out on video. So, biting your shield and getting upset on MAP isn't going to change anything. I would be open to discussion of precedent, other examples of crossover and where the line is drawn. For example, stances / kamae are pretty universal, I take it no-one is going to complain about their use in many different schools?. Or the use of the katana or tachi. BUT; Where is the line? Where does the bracket of exclusivity fall? I genuineley want to know what perspectives are out there, if folks would be so kind. This matter of intelectual copyright is important and I would be very interested to know how it applies, both in Japan and in the West. As I said earlier, you can go and train with many ryuha and have a wide and diverse knowledge as an individual. What I would also like to clear up is what is the framework for appropriate ways to pass this knowledge on. I for one have been teaching people to use swords for over 20 years and I've never charged a penny. So, no issue, I think there would probably be general agreement there, yes? I feel no problem in showing my friends whatever the heck I want to. It's when money gets involved things seem to get messy. Thoughts? Let's keep this polite, gentlefolks. Budo Ikkan. Jen.
Jen please explain your understanding of Koryu? Hyoho Niten Ichi Ryu is the Ryu Musashi founded. It is from there the Kata/techniques come. Are you saying Hoshin teaches Kata that are not part of the Ryu? If so where have they come from? What has he said that is libellous? Using words such as libellous insinuates a threat of legal action? Is that what you’re saying? It may it may not. What it will do is let the public make an informed decision on what they are getting as IMO what is on that site is misleading to say the least.
It does, otherwise it would not be koryu, nor would it be Hyoho Niten Ichi-ryu. Yes, anyone can read the Go Rin No Sho and benefit from it, but there are certain references in those texts which are for members of Hyoho Niten Ichi-ryu only and can only be really understood after many years of training, and instruction under a properly licenced teacher of the ryuha. Also it isn't his ryu, it is the ryuha he trains in. In actual fact, it's the soke's ryuha. Iwami sensei was given rights, full transmission and Miyamoto Musashi's own bokuto. For the time being, it's his ryuha. Noone else's. Sir, with that condescending attitude, you will be very lucky to be taken seriously in budo anywhere. We have seen the clip of the DVD being sold. It is using kamae, terminology and techniques from Hyoho Niten Ichi-ryu, plain and simple. That is the intellectual property of the ryuha.
Hi Jen, I have made no libellous comments, nor am I embarrassing the ryu. I HAVE, however, asked a few questions in the gentlemanly manner that you request, but they have not been answered. I have little knowledge of the TSKSR, so I will stick to HNIR kenjutsu, of which I have trained with Iwami Toshio soke, the 11th successor to the ryu. This ryu is recognised by the Nihon Kobudo Kyokai and the Nihon Kobudo Shinkokai, along with another NIR group, but their techniques are performed a little differently to HYOHO Niten Ichi Ryu. The techniques that Kyoshi Glimme is selling on his DVDs are taken from Hyoho Niten Ichi Ryu, although they... no, I'll end the sentence there and remain dignified. Now, from my understanding of koryu, the current head of the school is the caretaker of the techniques and, by western standards, owns the copyright. So then, it seems that Kyoshi Glimme has either studied with the Hyoho Niten Ichi Ryu & the Tenshin Shoden Katori Shinto Ryu or just copied the techniques from somewhere. Questions: 1) Has he studied with either ryuha? If so: 2) who was his teacher? 3) does he have permission to teach? If he hasn't studied with the ryu: 4) how did he learn these techniques? Has he created them from his extensive sword studies? I think Hoshin's current (and potential future) students should be aware of the answers before they part with money for the DVDs or for a seminar. Until Kyoshi Glimme can give an answer to these extremely reasonable questions, I have to assume that he has learned them from a video and is teaching something (via DVD) that he has not formally learned. I look forward to Kyoshi Glimme correcting me on these matters, and I have requested via email he visits the thread to assist. Kind regards, Scott
Er Sir is actually a Miss or Mrs not sure but definitely not a Sir....... Jen??? But I have to agree with Kogusoku here!
-Jen please explain your understanding of Koryu? > I'm only a 6th Kyu in Bujinkan, so just what I read when I googled it. - Hyoho Niten Ichi Ryu is the Ryu Musashi founded. It is from there the Kata/techniques come. Are you saying Hoshin teaches Kata that are not part of the Ryu? If so where have they come from? > I have no idea, I haven't viewed the sword dvds yet. I'm a Hoshinjutsu and meditation mastery bunny. - What has he said that is libellous? Using words such as libellous insinuates a threat of legal action? Is that what you’re saying? > well calling someone a liar in writing would qualify I would have thought? - It may it may not. What it will do is let the public make an informed decision on what they are getting as IMO what is on that site is misleading to say the least. > I'm all for clarity. Jen.
Quote: Originally Posted by Immolation No one had time to answer as the server was playing silly buggers yesterday. I beg to differ on that (spooky) Err.................Yes it was several times.
Nooooo I mean that no one had time to answer that's why I posted Jen's quote :bang: I wasn't on about the state of the server.
I stand by my words that if Kyoshi Glimme claims to have created these techniques from his own experience, then what I say is true and can be proved. Surely comments are libellous when untrue...?
ok, there are a lot of questions there and I am not about to adress each one in minute detail. (yes, the server has been playing up or at least my connection today so I shall keep this short befoere it falls over again). I haven't met Ed-kyoshi (Hoshin title) nor trained with him, seen the dvds or seen HNIR techniques so I wouldn't know if they are the same techniques. I believe he has trained with Katori to a resonably high level, not sure how high though, I don't know his history. You would need to address such matters to Hombu as I said, the email contact is on the website. Kogusoku-, thnks for clarifying that bit about lineage for me. it's Mrs, FYI. lol. Jennifer.
Having limited access because of the server issue may have preventing people from postings, just a long shot..
