Hanmudo=Hapkido & Judo

Discussion in 'Hapkido' started by DAT, Mar 21, 2004.

  1. BackFistMonkey

    BackFistMonkey Valued Member

    evilution ....

    Times change ... the human mind , body , and thought proccesses change . Martial Arts is constantly evolving as humans let go of the idea that one style is best . Martial arts should change and continue to evolve . Every style has something to benifit everyone .
    As as for using a name for marketing ... well people , its america ,the most : capitalistic , money centered , me first nation of the WORLD and america leads the rest of the world by example . You must come to expect martial arts to cash in on it too . Things like 15 + levels of advancement ( belts )@ 50 + bucks per belt test done in the same amount of time it takes to get 6 in other styles , accepting anyone who can pay into a Dojo/Dojang , exclusive black belt programs , over charging for boards ... these are the things people should be upset about not making the name: short , easily said , and to the point of the style .

    Stripped down is good ... streamlining is the key to efficiency .In a real situation its good to know alot of techniques but master the ones that work most frequently . That good old addage ... " Keep It Simple Stupid " is a vast wonderfull peice of advice .
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2004
  2. American HKD

    American HKD New Member

    Dear Max,

    I have alot of respect for all MA period and it's practioners.

    I respect each of the Arts CH incorporates but I still feel it's a cross training system and not the original Art of Hapkido. That's my opinion.

    Mr. DAT really wanted to know what's Hapikdo, CH, or Hanmudo and what he'd be getting in each system and I told him my opinion.

    You never heard me say derogitory things about any one who trains in CH or the techniques are no good etc.

    I happen to think Korean Hapkido needs little to no additions or subtractions to make it a great Art or combat ready.

    I don't feel Master Pelligrini could improve on 1000 years of evolvement on a combat tested system of Daito Ryu Aiki-Ju Jutsu and ancient Korean time tested kicking skills and weapon skills.

    I do feel many expirienced MA can re-organized any system they want to and make it popular with the right marketing.

    Here is a list of people doing it right now and advertising in BB Magazine.

    Combat Hapkido (HKD based)
    Shorit Ryu Tai Jutsu (Chin NA, Tae Kwon Do, Kempo, Jujutsu based)
    Sholin Kempo Karate (Jujutsu, Karate, boxing, Kempo, based etc.)
    Karav Maga
    Russian MA system

    All these guys are making the same claims as CH No non-sense, combat ready, cut the fat, real street stuff, etc. Its all marketing baloney, thier stuff isn't new just recyled a different way and taught maybe without Oriental etiquette.

    I'm sorry Max look at the patern here or we can agree to dis-agree nothing personal.
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2004
  3. American HKD

    American HKD New Member

    Dear Joint lock,

    I have no dis-respect for Master Pelligrini as a Human being or a MA nor do I question his skills etc.

    I'm also very open minded about MA and cross training as I said here before a few times I cross trained myself.

    Just call a spade a spade!

    As you said Pelligrini Do would'nt sell as well as CH.
  4. MaxG

    MaxG Valued Member

    No, it's not the original art of Hapkido and neither is the style you're training in.

    And you're entitled to your opinion. Just like I'm entitled to think that any martial art with that attitude is doomed to obscurity. As MANY modern martial artists do.

    He has never claimed to "improve" any particular technique. What he has done is gather together skills that complement each other through scientific study and real world scenerios. You would know that if you actually knew anything about CH and not base everything you know on the few articles you've read.

    I can't speak about those arts since I don't study them but I do see something in general with Martial Arts...the pattern I see is EVOLUTION. People doing the SAME thing that Ji Han Jae did. Didn't he add a lot of kicks to Hapkido from another style? Didn't he add a more spiritual side to Hapkido? etc. etc. He did the same thing that these martial art practitioners are doing. Combining all his skills into his (then) current curriculum. The only difference I see is you praise HIM for doing it but CONDEMN others.
    Heck even Choi didn't use STRICTLY Daito-Ryu Aikijujutsu techniques when he was teaching. His Hapkido changed when he trained with Bok Sup Suh and I'm sure it kept changing over the years. Are you going to condemn the creator of Hapkido for taking techinques from other styles and adding them to Hapkido? Accoring to your thinking didn't he just "recycle" techniques from other styles?

    Your words belie each other. Your posts have not only belittled and criticized CH but

    "Hwarang Do?
    Farang Do?
    Kuk Sool Won?

    and now

    Shorit Ryu Tai Jutsu (Chin NA, Tae Kwon Do, Kempo, Jujutsu based)
    Sholin Kempo Karate (Jujutsu, Karate, boxing, Kempo, based etc.)
    Karav Maga
    Russian MA system"


    Anymore systems you think deserve your ire? Why not just tack on few more for good measure? I'm sure that you're read this month's BlackBelt magazine. I'm sure there is an article in there on a style which you suddenly feel you can comment on based on that 15 minutes of reading.

    My final post in this topic because
    1: Unfortunately ,and I apologize to DAT, it has become very off-topic.
    Bottom-line DAT go check out that CH school for yourself I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
    2: While I have answered all your comments in a very organized manner and succesfully (imho) countered all your criticisms and falsehoods your retorts seem to be the same thing over and over again. How many times can you say "a spade is a spade"," a rose is a rose" {which I believe I actually posted 1st in counter to an earlier post of yours} in all these different threads? Your repetitiveness implies to me either a: you have no answer to my questions or b: you stubbornly refuse to acknowledge the facts I have presented.

    and finally
    3: I think anyone can see where I come from even if you don't...

    But keep CH out of your future defamatory and libelous posts. Because I won't sit idly by. I will defend it.
  5. American HKD

    American HKD New Member

    Dear Max,

    We see things from the opposite view point I don't think your wrong for your opinion nor do I think opinion is wrong. I agree to disagree.

    Your responces to my last comments not in the light I was trying to present them, and you twisted them from my actual meaning and intent.

    That can be a danger in a forum like this.

    I'm finished as well no point to continue here nothing good is happening.
  6. DAT

    DAT Valued Member

    No apologizes necessary. I myself have been involved in some heated arguements on some MA forums. It's good to be passionate about your art(s). It's this passion that fuels these type forums.

    So, with that said, back it down a notch and if anyone would like to continue with the discussion on the pros or cons of Han Mu Do, traditional Hapkido and Combat Hapkido, I for one would be interested in everyone's thoughts and personal experience in the aforementioned arts.

    What I've gathered through the rhetoric is that HMD is HKD with a different approach/arrangement to teaching the core principles and perhaps some more judo (yudo), Combat Hapkido borrows some core HKD principles but adds some other techniques making it more of an ecclectic art than an off-shoot of HKD. Is this about right? CH seems to be more like an extended in depth self defense class as opposed to an art that builds a foundation, trains the fundamentals while slowly added to the curriculum. Close?
  7. Thomas

    Thomas Combat Hapkido/Taekwondo

  8. davjohns

    davjohns New Member

    Just a little help. I practice and teach TKD. I practice Cbt HKD. I recently attended a seminar with the local HMD school. Very enlightening.

    From what I am told, HMD opens its arms to more than HKD and Yudo. The instructor that day started out in Judo, but swapped to HMD for its diversity. They also embrace Kumdo, archery, bo-staff, stick and cane.

    As to Combat Hapkido, it eliminates forms. Kicks are all below the belt. The techniques are reduced in number from traditional HKD.

    Hope this helps.

  9. James Bond

    James Bond New Member

    from my experience Han Mu Do = Yudo ( Korean judo ) + Taekwondo + Hapkido +Kuk Sool

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