Grandmaster Rhee Ki Ha resigns

Discussion in 'Tae Kwon Do' started by TonyMc, Oct 30, 2011.

  1. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    Yes ITF Tuls are a series of fundamental movements strung together. Yes they have a defined pace between movements, much like the metronome in music that helps musicians keep the musical beat. This is called rhythm & is a graded category in Tul competition. So there is an exact beat or rhythm that we must adhere to in between moves of the pattern, like 1...2...3...
    But then in the execution of the individual movements it will be more like A...B..C. if that makes sense to show the acceleration.
    Again it is confusing as our combinations have set parameters within the Tuls that define the movements & the revisions to SW to be able the more effectively complete the combinations.
    (Sorry this may be too complicated to explain via the venue)
    As far as SW goes, please think of it as a way to move your whole body into the movement & execution of the technique.
     
  2. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    Relax - explode is exactly what the ITF should be doing. I use that term or phrase often. I don't see the KKW TKD exploding as much, as they seem to be using mostly upper body strength, as they do not seem to utilize from the feet up. This is what I usually see in their patterns competitions. They step then execute, so the feet & legs are not more fully utilized IMHO. That was what I was getting at when I mentioned total body coordination.
    The best examples I saw of the differences was when SK sent a TKD team to NK to perform & NK sent one to SK to perform. I would imagine that both entities wanted to send their best, as it was the 1st time such an exchange was ever done. The difference was fairly apparent with regards to power execution in the patterns. Hence soft-hard.
     
  3. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    Yes the TAGB we early breakways from the ITF, gone decades now. They missed about 20 years of ITF TKD evolution under the Founder. While that have a massive organization with a large following & produce some great fighters, even WTF style rules, I would not consider them ITF. They may be better than ITF, but they are not ITF in my personal view.
    Many, many groups & people have left orgs along the way. When they do, they remain old(er) style or evolve on their own or with other influences. I think Kukki TKD also may have elements of this as well. I also feel that this is now coming into play more, as the KKW delivers their instructor course around the world now AND the WTF is holding WCs of Poomsae, requiring competitors to adhere to a set standard. The ITF has been doing this since 1974 & as a result have very good standardization. But those like the TAGB who dropped out along the way, would not fair well in ITF Tul competition in the WCs. They might do very well in sparring & the other 3 categories of competition, but in Tuls they are as outdated as the time period that they left. Again, not an attack, but reality.
    Likewise there were many Koreans who went abroad before the KKW was established & never followed the set standard the KKW taught. Others left after the KKW was established & changed things to fit their circumstances & increase revenue etc. So many claim to be ITF or WTF, Chang Hon or Kukki TKD, but maybe are better defined as older versions of such, if that makes sense.
    We in the ITF have sort of an opposite problem. With the passing of the Founder, we have splintered & now with the final arbitrator gone, there is differences arising in our previous wonderful worldwide standard. So while the KKW may be behind, they we catch up & exceed IMHO.
     
  4. Asterix187

    Asterix187 Valued Member

    Hi,

    I just thought I would post some good examples of ITF TKD patterns videos:

    The first is taught at green belt and I chose this as the start is close to the WTF pattern video above

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N33l-AI7ghg"]Won-Hyo - YouTube[/ame]

    The second is Juche which is a 3rd degree patterns and shows a few more tricky moves

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuiEzW4jti0"]Juche - Suska - YouTube[/ame]

    The 1.....23 is done in ITF but the 1...2 is performed from the last position to the neutral position (some people call position 2 chamber, we could start a whole new thread about the term chamber and the fact there isn't one). The 23 is then the accelerated motion from neutral to full execution.
     
  5. StuartA

    StuartA Guardian of real TKD :-)

    This thread is about GM Rhee Ki ha and his (supposed) resignation from the UKTA.

    IMHO.. people spend way to much time looking into 'performance beauty' or exactation (if thats a word) of patterns/poomse and not enough on what they actually do! It ashame IMO, as it leaves both ITF/KKW arts lacking!

    I have my views on performance from a competition POV as well .. but since the two styles don't compete against each other.. what does it matter!

    Stuart

    Ps. did someone mention sine-wave? :)
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2012
  6. StuartA

    StuartA Guardian of real TKD :-)

    Juche is a 2nd degree pattern and Suska is a great kicker and a pretty good performer, yet he cops out on the Dodging reverse turning kicks, which should be landed in L-Stance/Forearm Guarding block and not with the leg held out as he does it - a VERY difficult thing to achieve for sure, yet so is landing in Diagonal Stance with the Twin Palm Rising block, which he manages very well!

    Stuart

    Ps. OT I know.. but is there any videos of Suska sparring?
     
  7. Asterix187

    Asterix187 Valued Member

    LOL yes obviously your correct, its a second degree pattern. I should know that as its the one I am learning at the moment! Maybe I was just getting excited as I mean a pattern you need to get your 3rd degree....

    It seems within various ITF's the performance (art) side has outweighed the action (martial) side in competitions with mid section kicks being performed (and held) high. However, this appears to be slowly changing back to correct techniques etc.
     
  8. Gizmo

    Gizmo Valued Member

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSxiITlvuRU"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSxiITlvuRU[/ame]

    Very short clip, but you can get an idea.

    Seriously, Jarek Suska used to be a successful sparring competitor in his earlier years, including being an European Champion and winning a major tournament in North Korea in late 1980's or early 1990's. I've seen him sparring in national ITF events when I was much younger :)

    As a sidenote, he is the only competitor who participated in ALL editions of the Polish ITF TKD Championships held to date.
     
  9. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    yes but this forum has been very slow & quiet so I think it is better if we post about something!
    ;)
     
  10. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    Yes your right & the key to landing correctly after the 2 Direction Kick is not fully retracting after the extension of the kick.
     
  11. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    I have not noticed the higher kicking, but yes there have been many who have been posing the kicks. I see the ITF-V also slowing down the pace or rhythm of the patterns as well, which I feel is also less martial action or realistic as well. Gen. Choi insisted that the Tuls must be performed with realism.
     
  12. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    Gizmo can you please clarify what you mean by this?
    Do you mean he has competed in all 5 categories of ITF tournaments? Or has he competed in tournaments held by all 3 factions of the ITF?

    (Either one is most commendable!)
     
  13. StuartA

    StuartA Guardian of real TKD :-)

    True.. so perhaps starting new threads on said subject/s would be a good idea! :)

    Stuart
     
  14. Gizmo

    Gizmo Valued Member

    Well, here in Poland ITF-V is a powerhouse in comparison to the ITF-NK and ITF-C. ITF-C has held their 2nd Polish Championships this year and ITF-NK doesn't use the name Polish Championships at all.

    The Polish TKD Association (ITF-V) has been organising Polish ITF Championships since 1988, with 25th edition held in June 2012 - and Mr Jarek Suska participated in ALL 25 editions since 1988. Really impressive.
     
  15. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    Sorry I probably would if things are busy, but don't see the point, as things are slow!
    ;)
     
  16. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    yes it is & thanks for that tidbit of info
     
  17. Master Ted Hopw

    Master Ted Hopw New Member

    your instructor was wrong in telling you that, if it was not for Master Rhee none of

     
  18. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

     
  19. Benny the Jet

    Benny the Jet New Member

    LIKE!! Taekwon-Do for all!! Hopefully First grand Master Rhee will set president in setting the bickering Taekwon-Do world to rights! One ITF Badge, One United ITF with WTF brothers and sisters welcome to join in and be recognised as part of the Taekwon-Do family!!

     
  20. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    I personally do not see any reason right now for any WTFer or independent TKDin to join the very dysfunctional ITF family!
    They have the Olympics & are coming off a fairly successful Olympic Games. They dwarf the ITF & if anything, the ITFer would get more by joining them, don't you think?

    We shall see what happens next year with the IOC vote on the permanent sports for the Summer Olympics. Many think TKD will stay, as it affords great opportunity to for small & developing countries to medal at the Olympiad. Of course it will receive a lot of competition from the other MAs & other sports as well. But I think the WTF helped its cause with the better spectator friendly rules.
    From what I understand the WTF is hopefully optimistic with their chances in 2013, but realize it is not a done deal, maybe 70% there. I wonder what NK & their IOC Member will do????????
    Also look for the KKW to lose standing to the new TKD Park. With the TKD Park taking some of the functions away from the KKW & the WTF to offer their own BB certs.
    BIG things coming in TKD
     

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