First Lesson and groundwork question

Discussion in 'Judo' started by Southpaw535, Dec 12, 2009.

  1. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    No closed guard? Crap that means i was breaking the rules for pretty much the whole session
     
  2. Atharel

    Atharel Errant

    The closed guard is not banned in Judo. It is, however, a great excuse for a referee to yell "matte" and stand the competitors up.

    In competition, an open and aggressive guard is preferred.
     
  3. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    Ah makes sense. Reason I thougt it is I really struggle to escape side control but I've never escaped a back mount

    Oh. :(

    No I meant if as an opponent is getting side control or for whatever reason puts his arms within reach then wrapping them up with your legs. I managed it somehow and the guy on top of me told me it broke the pin?

    I completely forgot judo works on points and I can't just keep working for a submission :p

    Learning a new ruleset is a pain!! :D
     
  4. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    Ah so guard's allowed but you have to be constantly working for a sub or sweep?
     
  5. CKava

    CKava Just one more thing... Supporter

    This is a very depressing conversation :( but good information to know!

    The Judo competition rules are a bit disappointing because a lot of Judoka seem to really enjoy groundwork and be more than happy to put in time training it. Yet given what Atharel is saying it is extremely unlikely that you will get the opportunity to employ much of what you can do when engaging in extended newaza.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2009
  6. Atharel

    Atharel Errant

    Controlling an arm with your legs does not stop the pin timer. Controlling their *head* and arm, as in a side triangle, does. Or should, at least. I've heard stories of people being choked unconscious from a yoko sankaku jime but being declared the winner by pin.

    Guard is allowed, but the "show immediate progress or be stood up" rule is always in effect. Additionally, the closed guard is used a lot in competition as a stall method, so the referees might even think that you *want* to be stood up. On the other hand, if they suspect you of being a dirty BJJ'er, they very well might take any excuse at all to stand you up. So don't give them one. Attack, attack, attack. As you usually have to open your closed guard to attack or finish an attack anyway, better to just keep it open the whole time. You might even convince the guy on top to try to pass (and therefore open himself to an armlock or sweep or choke) instead of laying on you and waiting for the standup.

    CKava... there's apparently a bit of a schism between the IJF and "old school" judo people, who enjoy newaza and such. The IJF decided, arbitrarily, that newaza is boring to spectators and to therefore minimize its presence in order to boost Judo's ratings at the Olympics and generally make it more spectator-friendly. Additionally, since Kano himself there have been a lot of Judo people that look at newaza as "what you do if your throw didn't work", or "what you do if you suck at throwing", even to the point of saying such things as "Nice jujigatame! Maybe next time you'll get the throw". This crowd doesn't mind the minimization of newaza, as they regard it as being inherently inferior and secondary to throws. You also hear such tripe as that newaza doesn't embody the principles of Judo: kuzushi, minimum effort maximum efficiency, etc. While this obviously points out their own flaws and likely indicates that they are strength based brutes in newaza, it does not diminish their presence on the Judo scene.
     
  7. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    I feel so loved....

    I'll try that on saturday thanks for the tip.

    Thanks for the other parts of the post as well. I think my best bet now is going to be email my sensei if i can find his address and ask him to send me a list of the rules.
     
  8. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    I think this thread shows that there is a big difference to how judo is trained and how it works in competition. Often a big difference.
     

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