I'm no judo player, but I was under the impression that you forfeited some of the points granted for tossing the guy over, if your knee touched the ground first. :dunno:
I don't believe so UKJN, certainly not as a standardised rule as a drop knees seoi nage or "shoulder throw" is pretty common and frequently scores ippon. In fact i was thrown with one just last week, although it only scored waza ari. Regarding kata guruma, its usage will probably dwindle from now on, as unless you can counter with it, the direct leg grab will get you disqualified due to the new IJF rule change. Sad times
For real...Which is why independent Judo is the way to go...Who cares about the Olympics....I think Kano would be disappointed with the direction Judo has taken these days. . . . But that's another topic entirely.
In my opinion, the recent rule changes in Judo were brought in to favour the more 'stand-up' Japanese fighters, who were finding it difficult to cope with the more crouched over style of grappling fighters from, in particular, former Eastern Bloc countries.
I've heard that assertion too pugil, I've also heard that it was to distance the sport from wrestling due to pressures from the IOC. Either way it's stupid. If your fighters are getting beaten by leg grab takedowns, you teach them how to sprawl better, not change the rules for your benefit. Still Greco-Judo is still pretty awesome, and there'll be competitions outside the IJF that allow direct leg grabs.
next technique: scissor take-down (ala jap-gi). i add this because over dinner last night one of our instructors asked what the 'jap' meant, and master yang replied, "grab". this would make jap-gi our last set in the clothing grabbing (eui bok su) series. this take down is definately a sacrifice take down. now, ours is done with a left side/hook kick to the body, then the bottom leg comes up above and behind the opponents' knee pits (for lack of a better term). strategically i was wondering if a right round house kick entrance would be more advantageous. my opinion is that if the takedown fails, at least you will be in a better ground position to sweep, or simply push off the hip and roll away. thoughts, advice?
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3r55mxK2xKc"]YouTube- Cung Le fight clip doing San Shou[/ame] the technique is performed beautifully at approx 1.35 in the video.
Well, the scissor technique choladeva is referring to, herbo, is usually done across the torso, not the legs, but Cung Le did execute a superb VARIATION of what's supposed to be discussed. I also noted that just prior to the scissor move, he upped the guy over in a fashion not dissimilar to the previous technique we discussed (the fireman's carry).
First of all, choladeva, jap-ki is the korean term for grappling/wrestling, AFAIK. And I believe that's what master Yang was trying to get across to you (I invariably grab the persons appendages rather than their clothes when practicing jap-ki, FWIW). I've also seen the scissor done by jumping up really high and clamping your legs around the opponent's neck. It requires you to do a higher fall (nak-bup) but it assures the other guy's head gets slammed into the ground. :evil: As for the entry into this technique from the *standard* jap-ki position (right hand on their neck and left hand on their arm -for both sides- this means you're grabbing their arm which is hanging onto the back of your neck, near the elbow). I'm going to assume you (choladeva) meant that the technique is done to their left side, not that the hook kick is done with your left leg. At least, I learned to do it by wrapping a right hook kick around their abdomen followed by a left round kick to the back of their legs (near the knees). This requires that you cross-step to your right with your left foot as a preliminary move, in order to be in the correct position in relation to your opponent. My favorite variation for this entry is much easier to do than the effort required to readjust your balance for the hook kick, and yet it occurs to relatively few people despite being so obvious. Instead of doing a hook kick after stepping across the midline with your left foot, rotate to your right and use the momentum of your spin to belt their midsection with the mass of your right leg, which you torque as hard as you can (as if doing a spin kick). Then, instead of grabbing the back of their shoulders when executing the second kick, grab the front of the far shoulder. This should "clothesline" their throat efficiently enough to help topple them when that second kick lands in the back of their knees, and it still allows you to control their upper body per the *preferred* technique which is usually taught for this set. About your concerns should the takedown fail, there are two things you need to keep in mind about balance. One is to never attempt this technique on someone much bigger than you (king-kong syndrome) and the second has to do with center of gravity. If the person manages to support you after you've executed the scissor, unless they loom over you like a gigantic ape, by shifting your head & shoulders as far off to the side of their center as possible (hint: slide your grip to the arm closest to you), the resulting "center of gravity" for your combined bodies (which are being supported only by their legs), should topple over without too much additional effort on your part, but wriggling around a little bit couldn't hurt.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rEGdSFaIeqk"]YouTube- Human Weapon - Sambo - Scissor Takedown[/ame]
This is a great way to apply it, but you have to sit through nearly four-and-a-half minutes to see it: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ng8Gb6WImX4"]YouTube- Human Weapon [HQ] - Sambo: Russia's Extreme Fighting part 3/5[/ame]
FWIW, if you continue to roll one more rotation than is shown in that russian cambo vid linked by Pugil in post #56, then once you've downed your opponent you can sometimes tie them up so they choke due to their chin being forced into their own throat & chest (their entire weight gets suspended directly above all this, which adds to their anxiety and distress).
the other day master yang was showing us places to grab(from eui bok su/clothing grab techs) when clothing isn't available. these were like pinching fat and muscles like: the top of the triceps, upper-outer quadrant of pectorals, neck muscles, etc. the only problem is getting leverage. i am a chubby guy, so it is easy, but even on me it is hard to secure a grip on skin/fat/muscle for longer than a split second. thoughts on this and/or alternatives?
Once a guy was paired up with someone who had shaved their head (like master Larry White, for example), and when it came time to do head butt technique #3, he grabbed the guys ear instead, seeing as there wasn't any hair to grab. Where clothing grabs are advocated for a particular technique, and in situations where your opponent isn't wearing any clothing on that part of their body, or the material of the apparel you need to grab is too flimsy (T-shirts don't hold up like the top jacket of a dobok), you just have to improvise what's available to latch onto, or else switch to a different technique altogether.
since the topic of discussion has been about history for a while, i thought i would thread merge with the goings on of another KSH 1st gen maester's (mun, jin jeong) students. it appears as if they merge bang weon gi (master level 'circle defense techniques) principles with eui bok su: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BobIVs-OPU0&feature=youtube_gdata"]Heuk Choo Hapkido Clothing Grab Techniques - YouTube[/ame]
