many apologies for using a location specific nickname. "Standing Arm Bar" is a more definitive term: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leecBqLeQdg&feature=youtube_gdata"]Standing arm bar - YouTube[/ame]
If you've seen some of the Gracie videos out there you'll know that the solution to any attack is a flying armbar
although using the leges for leverage adds exponential strength, if the defender can support their arm by pulling up with the other.... SLAM of course a little bit of leg conditioning will be needed. nothing a few sam bang chos a day couldnt handle!
Not bickering with you, Pugil, but AFAIK the "standing armbar" is widely known in KSW circles as the "chicken wing." The Kimura demonstrated in your video is usually referred to as a "figure-4" armlock amongst those I know in KSW, since it often relies on the torque applied by grabbing your own arm after interleaving through/under your opponent's arm. The first technique that comes to my mind which uses such a joint-lock in the KSW curriculum, is SMS #10. FWIW
Like I said UKKJN, there are lots of names used in different martial arts systems. Judo simply calls what I'm showing in the video clip, Ude Garame (arm entanglement), but that also applies when the arm is the other way up (i.e. elbow down and hand up). To keep things simple, if I perform a standing under-the-arm straight-arm-bar, I usually refer to it by that name. In BJJ I believe it's true to say that most refer to my demo'ed armlock as a 'Kimura'. In fact, that name is used when the hand points down away from the head, towards the waist. If it's the other way up (i.e. elbow down to waist and hand towards head and shoulder) it's often referred to as a 'Keylock', I believe. In Shooto, the second version is called a V-1 armlock. In his book 'Shootfighting', Bart Vale calls the lock I'm showing in the video clip a Chicken-Wing Armlock, and the reversed position the 'Figure-4 Armlock'. The same name I use when applying it standing up — with my elbow hitting the face at the same time usually! Gene LeBell uses the term 'Dorsal Fin' when he is kneeling and has the opponent's head squeezed between his knees, with the 'Arm Crank' being applied with the hand pointing down towards the waist. I'd call Son Mok Soo 10 a Figure-4 Over-wrapping Straight-armbar. Especially as that describes it most accurately.
Exactly right. Coming from a BJJ background, it is indeed called a Kimura from side-mount. As for the reverse ude-garami, this is correct as well...as I have heard it as a keylock or an Americana in the US.
Here is another clip taken on the same day (for anyone who is interested that is), showing some further variations on the arm/wrist locks and entanglements: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7d2DktB2YY"]Groundwork ~ near to far side positions - YouTube[/ame] (In case you're wondering, my momentary loss of balance at around the 49 seconds mark was due to a sudden 'glitch' in my hip joint.)
would this be a good argument for using numbers applied to sets as oppised to names. i debated once with an aikidoka about this once, and was convinced they were for the better for naming the attack, side, move, and whether it was 'entering' or 'outside'. after this confusion i am back on the side of numbers! thanks for the vids batts sabeomnim!
Speaking persopnally, I'm all for making things as clear as possible for people. If you mean using names like they do in Chinese Chi-Na, I totally agree with you. I believe that what some might call an 'Underarm(pit) straight-arm-bar', in Chin-Na they call it 'Old Man Promoted to General' — which is not particularly descriptive, unless you are a Chin-Na practitioner! In Kuk Sool, the same technique can be found in Ap Eui Bok Soo number 5. If, however, we use the Judo name, 'Waki-Gatame', that allows anyone who wants to do further research on the technique for themselves to do so, both in books and on the internet.
Being honest I am not sure which way is better. I have done some Aikido, and if it wasn't for the fact that my language skills are very poor indeed, the fact that each Aikido technique is named logically and almost sequntially as Choldeva states, makes it pretty easy to follow. Unfortunately my Japanese is very poor, and I could never remember what is what and which is which. I like the numbering system for techniques in KS, but that doesn't really help when you are trying to find similarities and identify the same technique from a different grab and different entry etc. As you have to try and remember that KBS 3 is like such and such x and so on and so forth. That is probably why I like the terminology used such as "Chicken Wing" or "Bagpipes" or similar as it allows you to see which technique you are using no matter what its official name is. Let's face it a chicken wing applied from a shoulder grab is still a chicken wing if applied from a lapel grab etc. (I am using chicken wing since Bagpipes hasn't taken off here yet LOL:hat. All the best, Quozl
it is funny how we usually end up creating mnemonic devices regardless of the number to help memorize a tech (in sms# we say 'open the gate' fwiw). like vm uses the term kimura in a bjj setting (a hallowed move they named after the man who pushed helio gracie to the limit) it is probably called something else in sambo. both of these sports have a history in judo, however, due to lack language skills or sufficient need to acquire them, these two sports use different names for the same technique. and so i argue: language barriers seem to be easier to cross with numbers and sets.
okay, when applying the 'fireman's carry' (our aebs#4. bwooohahaaaa!!! mnemonic devices DO work better!!!), who here prefers to: tuck in close to the attackers legs and use the attacker's elbow as leverage throw over the shoulders VERSUS scooping and squat lifting the attacker, and dumping him on the head note: this can be applied to both inside and outside variations (jgsms, ysms, toogi and aebs)
When applying the "fireman's carry," I always prefer to use the leverage created by hyperextending your opponent's elbow across your shoulder, thus creating an "armbar." If they are reacting to the pain involved, they're less likely to offer as much resistance, try to grab you and drag you down, and whatever host of other countermeasures one might dream up. And while dropping an opponent on his head after pretending he's a barbell which you lifted into the air like a military press (or a fireman's carry), might seem like a cool maneuver, if he's a lot bigger than you are then lifting him onto your back or shoulders is going to be quite a challenge. However, by using the leverage already mentioned and by dropping to the knee on the far side of the throw, slamming him down on his head is still a viable option. :evil:
I can't remember what I called it in my book on Combat Sombo Choladeva. Russians are quite a pragmatic and down to earth people, however, so I suspect they simply call it an arm crank or something similar — albeit in Russian of course!
I definately prefer the use of the arm in the arm bar type leverage manouver mentioned by UK. Once the guy you are throwing is on his toes to alleviate the pain it is a lot easier to throw him, and if for whatever reason you find it difficult to through you can always snap his elbow:evil:. And I do like the dropping to you knee like UK talks about as well. That is a very nice finishing touch too :evil:
Hey Ollie, Sir, I never knew you were an author. I looked for your Combat Sombo book on Amazon and found it but only used books available. Is it still in print? (As a complete aside, did you also write this book Easystreet Guide to Cambridge: Including the Villages of Fulbourn, Histon, Impington, Milton, Stapleford, Great and Little Shelford: Amazon.co.uk: Ollie Batts: Books ?)
This is the same way I teach it, however by " across your sholder " I mead Slightly lower than your sholder on your upper arm. this keeps their arm away from your neck.
In Judo, the Shoulder Wheel (Kata-guruma) is performed on the inside, which means that you can't apply leverage to the elbow in the same way. In modern Judo (prior to the introduction of the most recent rule changes at least), the throw is performed in such a way that you don't have to lift the heavier guy (UKKJN mentions), as the attacker often drops down onto one or both knees at the last instant, in order to 'wheel' the other person over without having to try to lift them strongly. Some examples here: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHz40iUNIsc"]YouTube- KATA GURUMA COMPILATION[/ame]
The book was printed way back in 1996. Yes I'm afraid that it is out of print at present, although I am considering re-doing it with photo's instead of the line drawings used in the original. The EasyStreet Guide to Cambridge was printed in 2000 as an aide memoir to Taxi and delivery drivers. I didn't bother to follow it up with later editions as Satellite Navigation came in and kind of ruined things for me.
I also did a Leglock book some years ago, and never got round to getting the pictures taken for it. At the time, there were no books around specifically on leglocks. Now there are a few. It's still on my computer, however, and it's a bit different to what's already out there now, so who knows. Anyway, maybe I'll show one or two during the break periods at Rudy's event in August.
