Difference between Combat Hapkido and Regular Hapkido?

We have one that we call the figure four; bend uke's arm up 90 degrees. Slide your arm to the outside of uke's bicep and inside ukes wrist. As you lower your arm uke's arm rotates primarily at the shoulder. Rotate far enough and you rotate the shoulder out of joint.

 

You basically described a kimura in BJJ terms and they can definitely be effective.

 

Safe to say every joint in the human body has limits. Rotate anything far enough and something is going to give.

 

I think all techniques have effects that are possible and effects that are probable.
I think I start to take exception when a possible effect is trotted out like its a probable one.
The tendency to mistake the possible with the probable is far more common in arts that dont pressure test or spar.

 

that is frankly my major beef with hapkido, no pressure testing. and when you don't pressure test, people a.) start learning nonsense and b.) have no idea how to pull off techniques when they actually need to.

 

Its certainly not limited to Hapkido as itsthe same with many - in fact MOST - arts. I include my chosen way of JKD in that, which is ironic when you look at the way Bruce trained (spar, drill, spar, drill repeat...)

I can pull off some really nice JJJ locks...because i have drilled them over the years out of a KB & BJJ esque framework.

Like eye gouges etc.. if you cannot do the "basics" you have no right going to the advanced or the "cheats"

 

so true.

here's a great story...

in my last day of hapkido the techniques we were taught had to do with pants belts. for instance, darkened alley, attacker with a knife comes calling, you don't have a weapon, yes, grab your belt and use it to disarm or whip the opponent in the neck or eyes. when we were practicing the neck whip, my tori, who was supposed to go easy, whipped the heck out of my neck. like "oh SNAP!!!!!". i had my doubts about hapkido before and stuck around to get my black belt just because i didn't want to quit, but that was basically the last straw. it was all i could to to not throw the dude out the window.

me and some of my friends actually did try to pressure test our hapkido. but if you don't have the right framework (like boxing, mt, judo, bjj, wrestling), it just doesn't work as well as you'd like.

edit...

after reading this...i know someone could possibly say "well a belt whip isn't hapkido". and i get that, and you'd probably be right. but the thing is without pressure-testing, you might think that belt whipping is something that could be useful in an amorphous "str33t l3th4l" situation. i gave an extreme example. there are many in main line hapkido.

 

Acrually belt whipping is a tradmark of the Lebanese gang members I have encountered in fights

 

really?

i'm not saying that they couldn't potentially work, the belt whip. i guess to be really precise, not a very high percentage move.

 

They tended to fight "en masse" where it was a lot of flailing and I suspect they didn't want to get too close because they would get swamped. Also most just flat out cant fight, so a belt keeps the average punter away and makes you look like you are involved even when you arent

 

I honestly as i've said in another thread would love to learn proper Muay thai kicking technique. I've watched videos and such, but actually having someone who knows what they are doing watch and correct you when you are doing it wrong is just better obviously.

I have done a lot of punching, but as i've said before only for fitness, though I got pretty good with my hand speed and accuracy and working on combos... watching boxing to see openings and what not to do... however, footwork and all of that sort of thing is something I never learned other than to keep balance, feet usually shoulder width apart, keeping moving, etc etc. I think that naturally someone who kicks a lot with the shin is going to be able to do a lot of damage and people tend to think twice when they are really hit hard. Either way though, for me it's more about a lack of local places to learn along with doing the CH.

 

Don't get me wrong. CH can be a great art and well worth learning.
I'm not disparaging CH at all.
I liked that in CH (the way I learnt it anyway) you always preceded a joint lock, breakway or throw with some distracting or softening strikes and kicks.
That's as it should be in my book.

I never met Pellegrini (he came over before my time) but I've heard him described, by someone that could really joint lock, as one of the best people at joint locking he'd ever seen.
I'm not saying go and do MT.

All I'm saying is that techniques need to be appraised realistically.
As I said before about "probable" and "possible".
Striking the sternum will probably knock some wind out of the guys sails, stop some forward momentum and open him up for something else.
Target lower and might drop him with a body shot.
Striking the sternum might possibly break his sternum but it's probably not going to happen.

I'd be the same if a Thai guy started saying that breaking another guys leg with a roundhouse kick was "easy".
Again...it's possible but not probable.

 

No, I didn't take it as I should go out and learn something else.. it's really just something I would like to learn to incorporate into my CH. Leg kicks I know hurt... even done easy my instructor has shown me, it didn't hurt, but you could definitely feel it. I just think it could be useful as an opening strike, follow up strike or just in the heat of the moment when you see any opening.

 

My school spars...

 

by the way, if anyone is interested. GM Pelligrini is having a seminar in I think DC in a week or 2. Thomas could probably give you the exact info. I can't make it, but if you live in the Md, Va, or other area to check him out might be worth looking into if one was curious.

 

sweet. tell more about the sparring.

 

Medium to light striking contact with protective padding. We focus on closing interecepting, trapping, and then transition to grappling. No points.

 

Plus I occasionally spend mat time with my Brazillian Jiu Jitsu friends following their rule system.

 

nice. good call on the protective padding. it's better if you have it.

do you find that some people work better in this type of environment? in my sparring experimentation while in hapkido, i found that only a few people really did it well. bjj is different because everyone is expected to spar. but with something like hapkido, i found, and your experience might be different, that it took a bit of a different breed.

cheers.

 

In my school sparring is highly encouraged but is optional. Some of my students are in their 60's and some have prior medical conditions that sort of thing. But for the willing and able bodied we definitely get in there and mix it up.