Coach punches student as punishment for losing

Discussion in 'Tae Kwon Do' started by Rhythmkiller, Jul 21, 2014.

  1. Rhythmkiller

    Rhythmkiller Animo Non Astutia

    Really difficult story to digest given the principles of TKD particularly self control.

    Older people in my dojang have told me story's of times when Korean instructors would give them a dig in the ribs for fighting outside of school or play acting in the dojang but never for losig a competition. Is it the Korean mentality to physically assault/interact with a student?

    I was under the impression that this type of thing happened about 30 years ago. My dad also did TKD and could relay these types of stories but back then i think it was generally accepted. Is it the same these days? I haven't experienced it.

    http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/loc...ndo-coach-apologises-but-won-t-change-methods

    Baza
     
  2. Unreal Combat

    Unreal Combat Valued Member

    I really struggle to see how his disciplinary methods are going to make his team better fighters. All it's going to do is put them under even more pressure than they're originally under.
     
  3. Rhythmkiller

    Rhythmkiller Animo Non Astutia

    Yeah, the comments from people on that website are quite interesting and all condemn the coaches actions.

    It seems to be a cultural thing.

    Baza
     
  4. PointyShinyBurn

    PointyShinyBurn Valued Member

    A BJJ pal of mine trained Judo in Korea one time and was tapping a teenage kid in groundwork sparring. The instructor took the kid out back and beat him with a stick.
     
  5. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Valued Member MAP 2017 Gold Award

    That makes me want to swear. This shouldn't be allowed. It's not cultural it's human rights.
     
  6. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    We had some demo by Shaolin monks a few years ago. They had this amazing little kid perfroming with them.

    I commented to an instructor how impressive the kid was and he said something about how many times the kid was beaten to get that good. I looked at him and asked iif he was joking and he wasn't.

    I have always wondered if he was right or incorrect about that. Sort of took my enjoyment of watching that kid away wondering if it was true.
     
  7. Grass hopper

    Grass hopper Valued Member

    Cultural thing or not, beating children to make them perform isn't ok.
     
  8. Ero-Sennin

    Ero-Sennin Highly Skilled Peeper Supporter

    What do you guys classify as a "beating."

    For me it entails permanent or severe/long lasting injury, and usually a trip to the hospital.
     
  9. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Us civvies aren't up to your military standards :p
     
  10. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    No one should lay a hand (or belt or stick) on a child to deliver pain as punishment for not performing up to whatever standard they are wanting.

    Even one shot intended to deliver pain is wrong. The whole concept of punishment in this circumstance is wrong.
     
  11. Ero-Sennin

    Ero-Sennin Highly Skilled Peeper Supporter

    It doesn't have anything to do with the military honestly. I didn't grow up not getting hit, and I've had some doozies too but I wouldn't call it getting a "beating."

    I'm not against physical disciplining, but I do think people go overboard with it more than using it appropriately.

    I think it's more of a "not as sensitive to violence in any form" honestly. If somebody was catching a beating for losing, or not doing their homework, it means something different then "person got hit a couple times and got a bruise." One I think needs to be dealt with, the other is those people's business.
     
  12. Ero-Sennin

    Ero-Sennin Highly Skilled Peeper Supporter

    I think it's in poor taste, sure, but I don't see it as something atrociously wrong. I don't think the UN should be notified over human rights violations. I think the rhetoric may be getting a little strong for what actually happened (although I could be completely wrong here). People have a tendency to jump to hyperbole, where a couple of smacks turns into "he hit them so far it shattered 152.7 bones in his face and 7 in his knee!"
     
  13. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    Why should anyone get smacked at all for not performing a martial art as well as the coach expects? :mad:

    It is the principle of that whole idea that is wrong- regardless of how much or little damage was done.
     
  14. Ero-Sennin

    Ero-Sennin Highly Skilled Peeper Supporter

    I may be wrong, but I don't think the people in this article are doing martial arts purely for fun and enjoyment, or learning to simply defend themselves.

    You have physical punishment in a wide range of sports. Lose a football, basketball, baseball, or soccer game in high school and the next practice you're running until people puke (sometimes even right after the game). Many other times you do endless repetitions of the thing you messed up on while being berated. Seems kind of natural that a punishment involved with losing in martial arts would involve getting hit?

    This isn't to say it's right or wrong. I'm not condoning what this guy did but I'm also not speaking out against it. I'm just trying to understand where the outrage is coming from, why it's there, and offering my own view on it so far.
     
  15. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    No, Ero, it doesn't seem natural at all to me. It seems like abuse to me.

    Being berated or pushed to/ past your limits is one thing, but hitting someone as punshment is another thing altogether.


    Well, I will say it. I think it is wrong. Very Very wrong.
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2014
  16. 47MartialMan

    47MartialMan Valued Member

  17. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    Key part there being "prior to the 80's." As in over 30 years ago. Society evolves. As in outmoded outdated concepts of acceptable behavior.


    As for the first link, corporal punisment for bad behavior is not the same topic as punishment for not performing up to par in a sporting event. You do understnd the difference, right?

    Afraid the second link won't work for me. I have Explorer 8. I need to get a new computer.
     
  18. Ero-Sennin

    Ero-Sennin Highly Skilled Peeper Supporter

    You know, the Explorer browser is pretty good for downloading other browsers like Mozilla, or even Safari. You can do that, even with an older computer. :p
     
  19. Grass hopper

    Grass hopper Valued Member

    I would say it's somewhat situational and more about intent than anything else. My mom used to pinch me and my brothers, but I wouldn't consider that a beating.

    I Guess duration matters too. If I saw a kid get hit upside the head by their mother I probably wouldn't consider that a beating, but if she followed it up with a backhand or punched/kicked them I'd start to get concerned.
     
  20. AndrewTheAndroid

    AndrewTheAndroid A hero for fun.

    I don't know if it is simply a cultural thing but also a power thing. It is very common to hear stories of teachers abusing students here. Not just in martial arts but in regular schools as well. However the backlash from these stories can be swift and brutal. There is something they do over here where they find out where the person lives, their phone number, email, ect... and just harass the heck out of them.
     

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