Anybody ever seen www.canemasters.com? They contend that a cane is the one weapon anyone can take anywhere. Aside from the judge's pen, clothing used as soft weapons, the mad dog frequent flyer knife, a few others; and the fact that a fairly athletic looking young person would look kind of funny with a cane, what do you think of the idea, and the style? The 3 techniques displayed as a sample on the site look kinda iffy to me, but apparently they make them work at tournaments. One could probably adapt hanbo techniques... Anyway, what do you think?
To me, a cane is just a stick ... so my Kali training works just fine with it. If it's got a hook on the end, great, that gives some more interesting options. If it's a straight cane, it's a stick. In the same way, Hanbo techniques would work fine with a cane. I haven't seen the CaneMasters material but their thought process has some merit. The thing that gets me, though, is their canes. Their canes (at least the ones that I've seen) are designed with little extras like a beveled end on the hook ... it's not quite a point ... but it's not quite *not* a point either. I think (from a layman's POV) that this might be considered a "weapon" ... or "modified for the express purpose of being used as a weapon." I think I'd rather go to the pharmacy and buy a plain jane cane. Maybe a nice hardwood ... or maybe aluminum. Maybe one with a little brass duck head or something at the grip. But, whatever it was, it'd be something that could be bought right off the generic John Q. Public shelf. Then I wouldn't modify it. In a similar vein, though, depending on where you live, an umbrella is just as, if not more, practical. Most umbrellas aren't that sturdy. But in a SD situation, I wouldn't be "sparring" with it ... or even "fighting" with it. I wouldn't really care if it were still usable after the situation. And, even if it only survives one shot, that one shot with the umbrella is one that I didn't have to take with a part of my body that feels pain or bleeds. Personally, I'm a big fan of the flexible weapons you mentioned ... especially the clothes I'm wearing or those of my attacker. The chances are pretty slim of getting in a fight where I and all of my attackers are nude and there isn't a towel, rag, or shower curtain available. Mike
I have seen the Canemasters material (I have a couple of the tapes), and I am involved with an org. that Mark Shuey is also involved with. I train the cane myself, but I use variations of Hanbo techniques as well as others that are specifically cane oriented. Many I picked up from Papa-san's tape on the cane, as well as training with him in person. I wouldn't say it is the "one" weapon you can carry anywhere, but it is one of the better selection. The cane I use I got through Papa-san for I think around $17 and it is solid Ash and steam bent, not really fancy like the Canemaster's canes. It works great for me. If you are looking for things designed as defense tools, and legal, check the Duck, simple small lengths of rope, or a 6" piece of a broom handle, they are also very effective aside from those already mentioned here. Rob
From what I can tell about legalities ... *anything* (with the possible exceptions of pepper spray or stun gun) you carry, you should have a logical (non-SD) explanation for why you carry it. If your only reason for carrying it is to defend yourself. A cane, for instance, I wouldn't carry because I don't need one. An umbrella, possibly ... if it looks like rain. Something I do carry nearly all the time is a book. I'm an avid reader and I've given a fair amount of thought about using a book as a weapon because of this. I've heard a lot about Papa-san's "duck" ... but have never seen one. I nearly met him a few weeks ago (or maybe a month) but we couldn't work out the logistics. Eventually I will meet him ... and I look forward to it. I've come to respect him pretty highly from his posts over the past year or so that we've shared forum space. Anyway ... other options might include a screwdriver (especially if you're a mechanic or something) or a ball point pen (most people can come up with a perfectly logical reason to carry one or two). The impression I've gotten is that anything designed as a weapon, modified for the specific purpose of being used as a weapon, or carried with the specific purpose of being used as a weapon will automatically put you on thin ice if you have to use it. Again, I think that pepper spray or stun guns may not be as bad in this because they are designed very specifically as non-lethal self-defense tools and, as far as I know, are considered as such by most courts (but I could be wrong ... I'm not any kind of legal eagle ... this is just the impression I've gotten in talking with various people over the years). And, of course, what you can get away with will depend on where you are. Mike
LOL Mike, if he gets out the Duck, back up!!!! That thing doesn't tickle trust me If you do get to meet him, hand the man a small piece of rope and ask him about it, he really suprised me with that lol. Meeting him was definitely an experience I won't soon forget. Books are an excellent weapon, especially used as a suprise tactic if thrown into an attacker's face. Personally I carry a cane because of breaking my knee, it still gives me alot of trouble from time to time, so I actually use it when I do have it (especially flying because that small space makes my legs really stiff and sore). In some areas, Pepper Spray is illegal for civilians to carry, I know some parts of IL are really bad about that. Stupid law IMO but someone thought it was useful. Rob
Cool. I *love* flexible weapons anyway so would love to see what he'd do with a rope Yeah, the spine of a book can also be used for striking. Depending on the book, it may or may not do a lot of damage. But striking with the spine of the book is certainly better than striking with my empty hand ... the damage inflicted may or may not be as bad from the book ... but the book doesn't feel pain or bleed. Mike
That is one of my excuses for not giving up smoking, it may be bad for me, but it works really well when flicked into an attacker's eyes. Bad excuse but it does work lol. The spine of a book would be a great striking surface for the wrist area or something of that sort especially, also alot of uses for it if the attacker is armed. Something I hadn't thought much about until now. Rob
Yup ... I'm not a smoker myself ... but I've some pretty impressive "flipping" (accuracy and power) in my time. Yeah, the spine of the book is also good for nose or throat shots. Slapping the book flat across someone's eyes has its uses as well Mike
I remembered you writing positively about flexible weapons. To hijack my own thread, where does that come from? The only such thing I've ever seen is ropes attached to other weapons, and/or weights as ninja weapons, and the soft whip from various Chinese martial arts. You sound like you've got styles more adaptable to clothing.
Most of my material in that area comes from a system of Silat called Cipecut. Traditionally they use a sarong in training. They use the sarong, though, in various positions. Holding it in one hand, holding it in two hands, worn around their chest like a bandolier, draped over their shoulder, worn like a skirt ... etc. All sorts of ways. They also do some training with their "ikat" (also heard other names for this) which is like a large bandana that they use to tie around their waist to hold the sarong in place as a skirt ... or they'd wear the ikat as a head-wrap (what we might refer to as a "do rag"). I never learned material using the clothing ... but it's an easy transition from the various sarong methods to find clothing applications. So, when I would show people sarong techniques, they'd say, "Cool. But I don't wear a sarong." So I started taking the principles I had learned in Cipecut and applying them to clothing ... and it worked fine. Now when I show it to people they say, "Cool. Teach me." Strange the way people's minds work. I'm showing them the exact same material that I did with the sarong ... but they couldn't (or were too lazy to) make the conceptual connection without me holding their hands. But that's OK ... I enjoy the training and the material regardless The same can be done with the flexible weapons you mentioned. The principles can be applied regardless of the flexible weapon being used. I don't know for sure (maybe Papa-san can answer this one if he sees it), but I'd imagine that Ninjutsu does this conceptual translation with its weapons too (i.e.: taking the chain techniques and applying them to clothes and such). Mike
Just thought the mechanics might be a lot different without a weight at the end. It's so frustrating to be three hours' drive from Papa-san. Just a little too far. But, still-cool. Teach me (If I ever come to Ohio) Until then, I'll look around for a Cipecut teacher.
<g> Actually, I currently live in Texas ... but my instructor is in Ohio. I'll be moving to Louisville, KY in October To my knowledge no one in America teaches Cipecut by itself. What I learned of it, I learned from Mande Muda Silat. So, if there's a Mande Muda instructor near you, that might be a source for Cipecut (assuming the instructor has trained in that aspect of Mande Muda). There's a list of instructors at http://www.suwandaacademy.com ... it's not complete (people like my instructor who had permission from Pak Herman to teach many years ago but, for one reason or another, didn't keep their certifications current ... in my instructor's case it was a matter of time and finances that prevented him from staying current ... people like this aren't listed on that page). But it's a good place to start Mike
Jeez - Dan Inosanto has got to know more about martial arts than any other human, ever... Thanks for the list. There's one almost close enough. If I ever move the 50 miles down to Columbia, I'm going to be pretty busy between the Bujinkan taka-seigi dojo there and Mande Muda Silat.
LOL ... yeah. Dan is pretty amazing. I believe he was the first person to bring Pak Herman to the States (in '84, I think) and trained with Pak Herman regularly until Pak Herma's death in 2000. And now, as far as I know, Guro Dan is still training with Ibu Rita (Pak Herman's sister and now the head of the system). Needless to say, Guro Dan has *a lot* of knowledge in Mande Muda (and a lot of other arts too Mike
