bicep curls rep number

you are counting his "legs" as part of his body? even though he is disabled and living on a wheel chair? he IS training his whole body.

 

sounds good

 

I'm sorry but you're actually wrong. Doing curls and pushdowns alone will not put inches on your arms; eating food does that. You don't even have to do curls and pushdowns but provided that you do some kind of indirect arm work and eat a lot of food and get adequate rest, you WILL put inches on your arms.

I'm saying this IS the right way to go, and it's fact. End of story.

 

Sigh, I think we've had quite enough silly arguments and twisting of words for one day today, lol. You're wrong, eating food alone will not put add to arm muscle mass. But this is besides the point, since I never mentioned diet.

Please, someone link me to a study that shows that there is a physiological requirement to train a whole body in order to increase the size of one muscle, or drop it. There is NO biological reason why you need to train your whole body to put inches on your arms. Disabled bodybuilders are living, irrefutable proof of this, end of story.

We all know that generally compounds are better than isolation, and I've already stated that isolation should come secondary to compounds. But this doesn't mean we should ignore science to give weight to our arguments.

 

And again you are wrong.

Is there some reason that you are arguing against the most obvious and well proven fact of the weight lifting world. Or are you just playing devils advocate for fun.

He can do Military Press, Pullups, Dips, Pull Downs etc.

You dont have to do Deadlifts and Squats, but you have to do some of the hard nitty gritty compound lifts.

 

Go read a few articles on T nation, learn something, then come back. Your anus talk is getting old.

Obviously you dont need to just eat, dont start bringing up stupid points now. Oh wait, too late.

 

Don't reel off references to T-nation like a robot, it's so last month. It's not the Gospel.

I'm still waiting for you to link me to a study that shows training the whole body is necessary to build up individual muscles.

Although to be honest I don't think you understand what I'm saying, because we clearly agree that compounds are better mass-builders, and agree that compounds come before isolation.

Tell you what mate, YOU go on T-nation, find me a study that proves it is a biological necessity to train the whole body to develop individual muscles, and show me.

And while you're there, take a look at this training method by Waterbury himself, and take note of the Skull Crushers, Tricep Pressdowns and, yes, you guessed it, standing Hammer Curls he advises (just like I did!)

If they are 'useless' as you say then why on earth would Waterbury include them in a mass and strength-building routine?

This is a pointless argument Knight as we pretty much agree on everything except this biological quandary. You seem to misinterpret this as me advocating loads of isolation exercises, which isn't true.

 

And what qualifications do you have to tell people what they should be doing in the gym? *crickets*

 

When did I tell anyone what they should be doing in the gym?

I'm still waiting for the study I asked for.

 

Maverick as far as I know, there is no study because its not true. However, (mods correct me if my little knowledge conflicts with any facts) there is obvious reasons that compounds will make you bigger than isolations ever could.

I'm under the impression that compounds target waaay more muscles, including all the little stabilizers and muscles that you just cant hit with isolations. This means, youll eventually be able to handle a greater load, thus increasing gains even further. If you were to do, say for example, strictly curls, your biceps would suffer because of the weaknesses of the supporting muscles (forarms, triceps, shoulders etc...). Even if you were to try and isolate every muscle, you would never be able to do it, and you would still end up leaving some random muscle out and suffer because of it.

Not only that, but compounds increase neuromuscular effieciency to a greater degree than isolations. Which in turn, makes you stronger which leads to handling bigger loads and then bigger muscles.

As far as I know, you can induce hypertrophy by strictly doing isolations, but you wont get very much at all. Not even close to compounds... ...in the long run that is.

 

I agree with you entirely.

 

I do my arms on a seperate day to anything else and i don't do any compounds just isolate my arms (bar maybe dips)

 

When did I say that? I said eating will put inches on your arms. Is this not true? And no one in the world ever said that you can't get your arms big without getting your legs big. All anyone is saying is that you can't get your arms as big as you could potentially get them doing only curls and pushdowns. Two reasons why:

1. Prophet already stated that compounds work way more stabilizers and the muscles to a much greater degree, especially since the weight you're working with will be much heavier than how much you can curl.

2. Eventually, doing curls and pushdowns all day, your body will get tired of this and you will eventually plateau. "Variety is the spice of life."

 

Compounds build more mass than isolation because:
A) Greater load on a smaller muscle because other muscles can help handle the heavy load
B) Greater growth horomone release
C) Stabilizers to help the major muscle groups
D) More weight can be used for a higher stimulus and so on, that's the gist.

Compounds are also safer because they use a bunch of muscles instead of singling out one, reducing injury risk (having almost all the load on one muscle, and that muscle giving out or tearing ummm...sucks?).

Isolations have their place. They can help to weed out imbalances, capillarize a particular muscle (like if you have stubborn biceps, hit them with high reps to improve capillarization), uhh..there's other stuff, but you won't gain too much hypertrophy like prophet said (not saying it WON'T hypertrophy a muscle, it will, just not to the extent that a compound exercise will, and not as fast).

As for the whole "isolations make a muscle hypertrophy" crap, yeah, it'll happen. Overload and stimulate the muscle, provide proper nutrition to it, and rest it, it'll get bigger and grow. You don't NEED to work the whole body to hypertrophy the arms. It's just simply a helluva lot easier, and the amount of stimulation provided, as well as GH from a compound exercise like a squat or deadlift on the arms, is REALLY good. We're biomechanical adapting machines. It's what we do, provide the bicep with a load that makes it work past it's normal operations, it'll adapt. Same goes for any muscle.

Did I help the situation or instigate more stuff?

 

So if someone came upto and said i've been working out for 6 months now and i want to get my arms bigger, would you tell him to do some curls, preachers etc or tell him to deadlift/pullups etc more?

 

Id ask them what they were doing for 6 months if theyre arms hadnt been growing

 

You been drinking again Prophet, or are you like this on purpose? Who said there arms hadn't been growing? Just becuase they want to get there arms bigger, does not mean they havent already grown.

 

Well, then they obviously know what to do! sheesh, and enough with the drinking comments man, very inapropriate.

 

Well you seem to misread everything I type. And just becuase there arms have grown a little bit, doesnt mean they cant grow at a faster rate

 

Not misread at all.

In fact, it is you that misunderstood my posts, which were clearly sarcastic.


I'll rephrase my original response: "what have you been doing for 6 months" ...there. yikes.