Best MA for self defence

That's great and all, but of the dozens/hundreds of village hall Karateka I've met, I don't think any of them have been aware of it either.

Aliveness and pressure in training would appear to be the exception in Karate, and Karatekas like JWT are rocking horse poo.

If someone said to you: "I'm going hiking through some dodgy areas abroad. Very unlikely I'll come across any firearms, but there are occasionally bandits and kidnappers out there. I'll have a sturdy metal walking stick with me." would you say: "Get yourself down to your local community centre Karate class then! Sorted!"?

 

Train ....

Try a SIM day or two with JWT ...

See how your training stacks up under real pressure ...

Fight or flight

and remember "he who runs away lives to fight another day"

Safest SD is be aware and dontget suckered in ..

Smurf

24.5

 

Yet the ones that are are still far more numerous than HEMA practitioners

John Titchen, Peter Consterdine, Geoff Thompson, Iain Abernathy, Steve Cattle, Gary Spiers, Terry O'Neill....the list goes on and their martial progeny does too; and those are just the current/former UK based ones

No I would say "don't hike in that area stoopid"

And if it's a choice between being able to punch someone clean on the chin and KO them or maybe possibly have a slight crossover with waving an arming sword around I know which I would be picking

 

That are pressure-testing their skills? I'm not arguing the point, it's a genuine question. Everyone I've known who's done any Karate (and that is a fair number of people) has had step-sparring or light contact tag sparring as the pinnacle of pressure in their training, with the exception of a tiny percentage that did a full contact style. At least someone who's done a lot of HEMA sparring will have some amount of fitness and experience of unscripted pressure.

Take a wild guess if any of those appear when I search for "self defence bristol". Are you really saying that the kata and step-sparring approaches, with no pressure or grounding in reality, are now in the minority of karate classes? I mean, I'd be happy if that were the case, but I'd also be very surprised.

I already knew that would be your answer

I think a bit of adventure is good for people. If it is all about staying out of trouble, you took a really dumb SD move by becoming a copper!

I'd agree with that. I was talking about functional crossover to the physical portion of a good SD curriculum.

I'll be honest and say that most Karate I've seen is counter-productive to the aims of being able to scrap, and breeds habits and attitudes that leave people worse off than when they only had their natural instincts to work from. My knowledge is outdated though; has their been a renaissance in the past decade?

This is what I think of, in general, when I think of Karate. Pretty sure it's the most popular club in my area:

 

GKR is to karate what Ashida Kim is to Ninjutsu or WMAA is to TKD!

 

It is really popular though!

 

Even the light contact isn't when done properly - Alfie and his crew for example would hurt you on the mat, ring or the cobbles

 

Jump spinning hook kicks are not what I think of when I think of functional reality-based training!

People who can get away with that on the cobbles are the exception, and I wouldn't devise a SD curriculum around them.

Been watching some other Karate clubs from my area sparring. It's all tag that is stopped after contact, turning your back on your opponent, standing front-on without protecting the head trading blows to the body... about all the worst things you could do in a situation that had the possibility of weapons being used, or even to defend against unarmed attacks. At least with weapons sparring you inculcate some idea of threat levels and more appropriate footwork/stances so you're not parading your vitals around to your attacker.

 

Missing the point - pun intended - of showing Alfie as an example

His son Marcus made his boxing and MMA debut this year and dominated - I have sparred against FSK guys and they can legit motor, yet you would dismiss them as "tag" had you seen their training. And no they are not exceptions and nor do they throw spin hook kicks in square go situations...but I will pick them over many so called SD stylists if it came to blows

 

Given the propensity for poor training in karate I'd say it's just as bad a suggestion for self defence as HEMA.

I thought the first few posts covered the blatant hole in the opening question anyway.

There is good karate around of course. As someone who lived in Bristol for a good while I recall there being some reputable goju with full contact multi-range sparring, for example.

 

Oh the original question was answered ages ago..we are now just freestylin' the snot out of the thread!

 

Similar to a lot of martial art schools. We have to replicate the real world.

 

Yeah, I've said quite a lot of times already that I don't think HEMA is SD. It patently is not. What I've been saying throughout the thread is that in terms of help-to-hinderance ratio of "unlearning" needed to transition to something functional and practical, I'd take HEMA weapons training over most Karate or Kung Fu weapons training. Thread sidetracks notwithstanding.

I'm happy to take people's word for it that there are Karate clubs doing great weapons work, I've just never seen it and was curious.

 

Well, that would be simulated pressure.

The whole point of SD is to avoid real pressure.

/smartass

 

True. Not going to get as far just looking at treatise and trying to replicate.
The point being ,by all account those guys knew what they were doing . Wrestling being a big part of their game. And wrestling still proving itself today. Give me European arts like wrestling and its variants over some of the eastern styles any day.
Wrestling and boxing , which are European martial arts, as a fundamental physical component and then adapted on the spot to the situation with a violent mindset , is perfectly fine if you have to fight back in an emergency situation. Well not perfect, as nothing is, but as good a base to riff off as anything out there.

Yea claiming HEMA as prime SD defence material is questionable.
For me anyone claiming anything is questionable haha. As in it's SELF defence. And as every situation is infinitely variable it's up to the individual in the moment as to what could be done, which will depend on an infinite amount of factors. No one else will be there.
It's up to the individual if they are concerned with their safety to go where the evidence takes them and engage in practices that have been proven to them.And then make a decisions and take responsibility.

SD as a thing that can be packaged neatly doesn't exist. It's just another emergency situation that could happen in life.
The only way to prepare ,like anything, is to have fundamental skills , be that physical or psychological that can be adapted and are flexible in all situations plus an ability to come up with whatever needs doing in that moment.

 

whats a SIM day? Is that sim as a acoronym or simulated shortened?