Are there any religions based on logic?

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Dead_pool, Aug 1, 2015.

  1. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Iron fist -

    Your trying to redefine what " logic is", could you either
    A) not do that, or
    B) provide your definitions so we can see into your main points, which currently are very fuzzy (unless your using quantum debating tactics?)

    That would be just great, thanks.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2015
  2. ludde

    ludde Valued Member

    Ultimately, when discussing with religious persons, it ends up with a belief in a deity that is outside of normal understanding. It is not bound by any rules. They can believe in miracles because of this deity. Everything is possible with this deity.

    I propose that everything that IS, have logic. The fundamental aspect of a religion is not based on evidence, and the likelihood of it being true is remarkably slim. We would have found evidence by now. So, if everything that IS have logic, then religion is the opposite and have no logic.
     
  3. philosoraptor

    philosoraptor carnivore in a top hat Supporter

    Just a general thought but if your argument can be used to prove either God OR Batman then it might be time to go back to the drawing board.
     
  4. LemonSloth

    LemonSloth Laugh and grow fat!

    Hold up. You need to clarify that sentiment.

    Logic itself is not a thing so much as a method of deduction.

    And as with all methods of deduction, they are limited by the resources, perspectives, information (etc) they have available.

    It is not by itself a fixed, objective thing that can be empirically measured per se.

    So to say that "logic failed" wouldn't be an accurate assessment in itself. At best you could say "Einstein's logic failed" or "the logic of the people examining X failed". But not that logic itself failed.

    There's a colossal difference between "This is not logically possible" versus "I cannot see a logical outcome to this equation".

    The process of logic or the ability to examine, perceive and understand the world & universe around us?

    Say for example someone asks me to multiply 15.3 by 2.2. I can conclude, following a logical mathematical equation that the answer is going to be 33.66 in almost all cases (apart from 0.00000000000001% of cases. Damn probability shenanigans). Alternatively, I can get a calculator and check that is the case.

    However, if I do not have an education in mathematics (for whatever reason, even secondary education), I might not be able to perceive that 33.66 is the answer to the equation. That doesn't mean the answer is wrong, but that my perceptions and measures of examining the evidence are limited.

    Going back to your analogy, I'm not seeing a clear cut point in which "accepting the impossible" is a logical process. Perhaps I'm missing something.

    Why not both?

    The thing about the existence of God is not so much that is impossible that a god/God/god(s) (etc) cannot exist, but that at this time there is no empirical, testable evidence that such things can be proven to exist. This does not mean they cannot exist, just that they cannot be proven to exist at this time.

    So whilst it is not logical at this time to assume a deity of some kind does exist, it's also not logical to assume it does not exist. Indeed logically, you'd be safer assuming something doesn't exist but being open minded to the possibility you are wrong.

    AKA the scientific method :p

    Nowt wrong with Neitzsche. Just so long as you don't bring up Pascale's Wager :p.
     
  5. Giovanni

    Giovanni Well-Known Member Supporter

    i'm guessing what iron fist is getting at is not whether god and science are compatible. i think he/she is getting at that one of those things cannot be true or not true at the same time.

    it's a classic logic test.
     
  6. LemonSloth

    LemonSloth Laugh and grow fat!

    Ah, I see. I did wonder if that was the case.

    But surely that's a faulty premise in itself?
     
  7. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Surely it depends on how you define "God" - it means something different to each religion on some very specific points so what MAY be logically true for one may not for another
     
  8. Giovanni

    Giovanni Well-Known Member Supporter

    oh yes, absolutely.

    i can't speak for iron fist, but it seems like he's talking about a logical contradiction. in other words, giovanni cannot exist and not exist at the same time.

    well, maybe i can <queue evil laughter>
     
  9. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Agreed, and it is a bit Schrodingers cat and kinda misses the point
     
  10. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Einstein innit?
     
  11. Giovanni

    Giovanni Well-Known Member Supporter

    like you were saying, the cat. which is a mind blowing thing, right. again, i'm pretty stupid about things, but the very, very little i know about the quantum world is that you can have a cat that's both alive and dead.

    that's just crazy pants.

    which is kind of why i laugh at the "first causers". for one, no one has proven "everything that exists must have a beginning". and two, quantum theory has really changed how we can view reality.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2015
  12. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Deleted for sake of clarity
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2015
  13. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

  14. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Last edited: Aug 5, 2015
  15. ludde

    ludde Valued Member

    "Open your mind too much and your brain will fall out."
    - Someone way wittier than me.

    Not hinted on you LemonSloth.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2015
  16. LemonSloth

    LemonSloth Laugh and grow fat!

    You know, I've always wanted to know who said that...
     
  17. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    First recorded instance was 1937

    But the more "gentle" usage was in 1939

    source: - http://www.skeptic.com/insight/open-mind-brains-fall-out-maxim-adage-aphorism/
     

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