Are there any religions based on logic?

Discussion in 'Off Topic Area' started by Dead_pool, Aug 1, 2015.

  1. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    I'd say its too individual to answer. Being born into religion is very neat given the upbringing and (apologies for the negative connotations but its the best word I can think of) indoctrination of growing up with it.

    I've actually been trying to get into religion for a little while now. Couldn't tell you why, but there you are. But of all the ones I've researched they do all hit a snag where I go "ehhhh that's kinda moved into mythology" or its required me to acknowledge something I can't marry with my brain logic. Of what I've read certain sects of buddhism are probably the closest to I've come to finding a religion that didn't require such leaps or wilful ignorance and that I could get along with it, but even then its not completely clean.

    I imagine it is possible to alter the teachings to adapt to personal preference, like the difference between Christians who take the bible literally and those who take it as allegorical. But even then there is a limit to how much you can fiddle before I'd say you're not following a religion but simply liking some of its parts.
     
  2. Nachi

    Nachi Valued Member Supporter

    Yes. But on the other hand, math doesn't go against religion as much a biology, for example. And there are dogmas, too. Also in the past centuries all the european scientists were religious, too and most of them didn't dare go against the dogmas. Let's hope we are more open-minded today :)

    But I get what you mean. Science tends to be more objective and actually looks for answers and tries to prove their claims, that's for sure. (But it doesn't mean it is unconditionally right).

    That's a nice comparison :)
     
  3. matveimediaarts

    matveimediaarts Underappreciated genius

    IIRC, 5 point Calvinism. I'm not as well versed in world religion as some others here, though. Some would argue Catholic Scholasticism too, but I don't think so. Calvin was a lawyer, so you can imagine what he was like. ;)
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2015
  4. Smaug97

    Smaug97 Valued Member

    Aaradia and 8limbs i cannot agree enough with what you said- i fail to see what religious arguments actually accomplish- I'll happily get along with most people regardless of what beliefs they hold,i just don't see what people gain from exhausting themselves over religious arguments.
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2015
  5. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    try reading philosophy, its a good place for logic over non logic
     
  6. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    mostly its that faith based (I.e non logical) beliefs, tend to cause trouble in the real world
     
  7. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    What about catholicism / calvinism Iogically based?
     
  8. LemonSloth

    LemonSloth Laugh and grow fat!

    I think you could if you were just prodded with certain questions every now and again.

    FWIW, I would have had you pegged as leaning somewhere between one of the many variations of Buddhism (I can't tell you the difference between say Theravada & Mahayana Buddhism anymore, yet alone any other denomination) and LaVeyan Satanism. It's actually got nothing to do with belief in a literal deity of Satan and God (etc), but is more of a individualistic/nihilistic ideology that focuses on promotion and "perfection" of the self.

    I know they are hideous umbrella terms, have you thought about looking at some of the variations of Wiccan/Neo-Pagan faiths?

    This thread has got me scratching my head though. I'm rusty as hell on my theology because I haven't looked at different faiths for years, but OP's got me musing now.
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2015
  9. Ben Gash CLF

    Ben Gash CLF Valued Member

    This is a problem when you look at things from the outside. You run the risk of focussing on the the wrong things or asking the wrong questions because you lack the foundation in history and context. This is a problem with critical analysis of religion, it's often very hard to do without a lot of study. For example literal translation of Genesis is not historical. Church scholars had discounted it 1600 years ago. Also when viewed in the wider context of the faith a literal translation of the early chapters of Genesis is actually heretical. However to know that you'd have to know something about early church history, understand the Christian views on the action of God in the world and know about heresies.
    Ironically I would suggest that the people who adopt a pick and mix approach are the people who profess biblical literalism.
    I think one of the problems Christianity faces in the Western world is that people think they know about it.
     
  10. The Iron Fist

    The Iron Fist Banned Banned

    You mean LaVeyan Satanism, right? Buddhism is not Nihilistic whatsoever, and definitely doesn't promote "perfection of the self". What self, according to Buddhism, is there to perfect?
     
  11. matveimediaarts

    matveimediaarts Underappreciated genius

    Calvin strips Christianity of "mysticism" in favor of a tightly argued, rather "legalistic" system of thought. Calvin is most famous for his five points (TULIP), but that's only part of his system.

    Scholastics (and Augustine) sought to reconcile Catholicism with classical Greek philosophy. Augustine was a Plato/Platinus fanboy and his philosophy is now known as "Christian Platonism".

    You can disagree with the premises and/or conclusions of these guys, but there's no doubt that they are "logical" in the Western sense.
     
  12. The Iron Fist

    The Iron Fist Banned Banned

    Brother why should everything be based on logic? Logic only goes so far, whether you're describing the human experience or the fundamental nature of the universe, at that level human logic no longer works! :) You could argue maybe it just hasn't figured out how, and that's a great philosophical question brother, and I think it's there you'll find the religions. Some religions really do attempt to use both logic and "unlogic" over the years, but it's important I think to realize that religion and science shared a long history before becoming distinct, separate disciplines in just oh the last few hundred years, if that. You will find many religious scientists, as well as scientifically-minded people of faith.

    In a Venn diagram, they could be shown as separate circles with an overlap, but their furthest reaches are relatively inaccessible to each other. One deals with the extreme limits of human logic, and the other the extreme, possibly infinite human imagination.

    Is imagination logical? Would you want it to be?
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2015
  13. matveimediaarts

    matveimediaarts Underappreciated genius

    Ya, this^^
    Dr Phillip Carrey, in his course on Einstein's theory of Relativity, does an overview of the history of physics. A lot of folks he talks about (including Plato) brings loads of religious prescriptions to their method.
     
  14. LemonSloth

    LemonSloth Laugh and grow fat!

    Yeah, my nihilistic comment was meant to be about LaVeyan Satanism, not Buddhism. Apologies if it came across wrong. :)
     
  15. Mangosteen

    Mangosteen Hold strong not

  16. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Thats where we disagree, logic is everything, science is the study of the fundamental nature of the universe, and through it, we have seen inside the atom, to the beginning of the universe, we have peered accross the galaxy and through time itself.
    Non logic is simply denying these wonders, in a king canute like attempt at denying what logic and process has brought humanity.

    God is simply a manmade device for controling others and explaining mysteries, now theres less natural mysteries to explain, it simply remains a device to control people.

    Although the current pope is at least using his powers for good.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2015
  17. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    And you sound just as judgmental as the religious extremists when you say things like that.
     
  18. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Logically please point out where my judgement is wrong, I'm open to logical debate, I can and will change my mind when faced with evidence.


    Its the use of 'non logic' I abhor, its essentially saying I cant explain it, and I wont even try.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2015
  19. qazaqwe

    qazaqwe Valued Member

    "i don't understand it...i know, god did it! now i understand!"
     
  20. LemonSloth

    LemonSloth Laugh and grow fat!

    Didn't Terry Pratchett refer to that as the "god of the gaps"?
     

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