ok i've looked through at least three other sites. i've used the search engine on MAP and still i can find NO mention of a form of martial arts that specialized in the axe. i know that theres one that incorporates the axe but its place isn't that special among the multitude of other weapons used. what i'm looking for is a form of martial arts from anywhere and any time that was designed for the axe specifically almost like kendo and iado (i hope i'm spelling that last one right) is designed for the sword if you know of one please tell me about it cause if not then i'm gonna have to make one up myself and that'll take MORE time just thinking up the moves to attack, defend, counter, etc.
I suspect not, on the basis that lumberjacks didn't need martial finesse due to being large angry men with axes. On a more serious note, axes and the like were featured only in european armies. And European MAs have not survived very well at all.
I think you'd be better off finding an art that includes axe work, and learning from that rather than trying to make up your own art. Creating an art requires a knowledge of fighting, not just a good imagination; how many fights have you been in involving axes? Off the top of my head, I can't think of an art that includes axes... Perhaps you could look at tomahawk throwing? While it almost certainly wouldn't include close combat attacks/defenses, it would be fun and teach you proper handling and use of a axe-like weapon.
Can't you find a art that uses the Kama in a kata or something? Then transfer those movements to an axe?
axe hmmm, well there are quite a few that include axes which i will cover, though the axe as you will have no doubt surmised is a peasant weapon. if a fyrd needed raising they would take garden axes,pitchforks and threshing flails to the fight. as peasant weapons, they did not have the glamour to appear in the majority of fighting methods and manuals. its a pretty simple weapon to use with the right martial sense. you can use the wooden haft as a blocking tool, use the wooden butt as a striking weapon. use the hook of the axe to hook the leg,arm or weapon. use the chunk of metal/wood at the top of the axe as a striking weapon, and obviously use the axe as....well...a chopping weapon. its got a lot of weight one handed or two handed so you can with confidence pinch the dynamics from any art which uses a weight on a stick such as hammer/mace techniques. so pilfer what knowlege you can from single and double hammer in chinese martial arts and where ever else you can find similar weapons. i shall list what i know - axes are common throughout Chinese martial arts, they have single axe, double axe, short hand axes and so on. each form with said axes should provide a plethora of techniques to be going on with. Im sure if your up front with the sifu, if he can accomodate a begginer in the weapons class and he uses axes in class then youll be on to a winner. i doubt there would be sparring though. Wushu schools, Choy Lay Fut are two arts i can think of that use them,but hundreds of kung fu styles have axe forms so just ring up whats close to you and ask. Western martial arts - in WMA, there are plenty of textbooks on the use of Billhook,halberd and glaives. all axe deriviatives. some arts go further back and utilise techniques they can infer from poetic saga's, artwork,sparring and guesswork to figure out dane axe work. for this you can either get hold of a western martial arts group such as academy of historical fencing or boars tooth school. however WMA schools are rare and axe work in them even rarer. one good point is that most WMA will accomodate any historical weapon if you can bring good techniques and sources to the table as they are pretty open classes. plus their is often lots of safe sparring, in which if you can buy/make a safe training axe you will be able to use it. Some Filipino and indonesian use short axes as part of their syllabus, again worth asking as its pretty rare, but it exists and always worth a phone call. Indian martial arts such as kalaripattayu and Gatka and others also heavily feature the axe, infact of all mentioned i would go with these if you can, axes are held in high regard in indian martial and kingly tradition, used both mounted and on foot and in huge variety. Good luck
Doesn't "Cold Steel" produce axes, conduct seminars, and offer training videos for them? You might dig a bit at their website (www.coldsteel.com)
first off a person can use an axe with finesse and not only brute strength as is the case with all weapons. and i do agree that european MAs if they ever existed in large numbers have not stood the test of time so far
Well, sure they existed. How could they not have? I'd disagree with Atre about axework only being found in WMA though (unless I misunderstood that statement, which is certainly possible). As Tommy pointed out, there are other styles that feature axework. Though none that I know of that focus heavily on it.
well i know they existed and still do but the point of them existing in large numbers if they did exist in large numbers then certain styles such as those that might focus heavily on the axe are lost to time. damn you dark ages and william the conqueror!
most people who grasp basic weapon concepts could teach you how to use an axe in a day. hell i think i could teach you some good ways how to use an axe in a day from my experiences in WMA. thats the beauty of the weapon. It like the spear,pitchfork,hammer and threshing flail is a simple weapon that can be used simply yet proficiently given you put in the hours. To learn all the movements wouldnt take very long, how to use the haft to block and strike, the axe head to hook,disarm and chop and so on. what would take longer is footwork, how to move on balance. then even longer would be learning strategies when using the axe, how to keep momentum and pressure. It is not a defensive weapon.you need toknow how,when and why it was used. A good idea might be to look at the use of half swording, many binds,locks,disarms and strikes are done with the guard of the hand a half sword. these techniques resemble axe work to some degree. I would highly recomend finding a WMA class, seeing if they have some kind of polearm programme, if not then after a while discuss how to buy/make and use a training axe and just drill drill drill then spar spar spar and then drill again. failing that Indian martial arts, Failing that Chinese. Failing that your on your own and will have to find ways of reasearching with people who have worked in other weapon or non weapon martial arts and dont mind lending a few hours to help you drill and spar. Let us know how it goes. and BTW why the particular interest in that weapon?
Again, I have to ask, how much have you used an axe for fighting? Heck, do you even know anyone with experience in this subject? If the answer is no, how can you state with authority that "an axe can be used in x manner"? I'm not arguing that an axe is only brute strength, I have no experience with them as weapons, but you'd do well to refrain from making absolute statements until you actually have some experience with the subject. I hope this doesn't come across as nasty, just a friendly piece of advice.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-L-_3dATMs"]YouTube- Cold Steel - The Fighting Tomahawk DVD[/ame] [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOeB2yMU_q8"]YouTube- The Fighting Tomahawk[/ame] Tomahawk fighting but it could get you started.
a very good idea, the viking re-enactment groups usually a) know their stuff historically and have trained in some WMA b) have access to training equipment and knowledge of training methods. c)will have the knowlege to guide you further down the road, as they will probably know other reasearchers or instructors. Another idea could be to contact ARMA or another WMA group, posting your interest in the subject field and see who responds, its much easier to get reasearch done in groups, then you can learn and train together. WMA is hard work to reasearch needing a certain skill with computers(to access the documents), language (to decipher the german/italain/latin), martial arts (to get the moves to work) and luck (bringing it all together).
The SCA is around a lot of places. [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhZ3dA4diZA"]YouTube- Dueling with Axes in the SCA[/ame]
no offense taken. i do have some experience in axe fighting. i'm apart of a group called amtgard which is a bit like sca. i chose the axe starting off cause at the time i thought it was only good for brute force. after using it for a few months i realized that was not the case and that the axe could be just as versatile as a sword the key points of it being that if in stead of using the strength technique (chop chop smash smash pretty much) and focused more on footwork and throwing shots that kept the momentum up without tiring myself too much i could actually dance around my opponent. so i took what i learned from amtgard and decided to practice with an actual axe. because of the weight issue (amtgard only uses foam sticks) i started using more footwork but still i was able to do the same thing. but heres the rub. most of what i was doing came from intuition and experience and while those are good starting points and they do help with training if you rely on them solely then you're gonna miss out on other moves/stances/styles that come from training you get from a martial art. as stated before i know decent amount of the techniques with the axe that you mentioned such as blocking with the haft disarming with the bit etc. i will definitely look up half swording techniques and i'll see if i can't find a place that teaches polearm. hopefully i can find something to my satisfaction if not i'm on my own cause i've looked several places to no avail and in fact thats the reason i put this thread up so i could have every cranny looked in before i start thinking "maybe i should just make my own martial art" and as for the particular interest in the weapon. part of its hereditary (i'm german/czech/irish/scottish) part of it is the fact that when troops got more into platemail weapons like the axe and hammer were used more often and yet the sword is the symbol of a knight. but most of all its from a respect i have for that type of weapon through experience
I find this groups research on axe in combat use very informative. http://www.hurstwic.org/history/articles/manufacturing/text/viking_axe.htm
