Apathy and Denial

Discussion in 'Women's Self Defence' started by STASH, Feb 15, 2004.

  1. STASH

    STASH New Member

  2. Judderman

    Judderman 'Ello darlin'

    A terrible thing to happen to a person and their relatives. Very brave of Kris to relate it to all. This story is sure to open the eyes of some women. But I feel it may also close them tighter for others.

    Apathy and denial are typical responses to fear. People know that this sort of thing happens, but they can't handle the fact that it does, so run away from it more. I think a lot of people would admit to being in fear of crime and would understand that they are just as at risk than the next person. Thing is they don't want to live in fear of this sort of thing so they except is all part and parcel of modern life and hope it doesn't happen to them.

    How do you bridge the gap? How many women attend a self defence class because something happened to them or a close relative? How do you get people, not just women, to be proactive instead of reactive?

  3. STASH

    STASH New Member

    Come on people...that cant be it.
  4. nekogami13

    nekogami13 Master of all I Survey

    Pretty standard sales tactic. Scare the person with official sounding statistics, testimonial letter, blah,blah,blah. As I said, pretty standard sales tactic used by everyone selling learn to fight in 5 easy lessons, etc.
  5. STASH

    STASH New Member

    Learn to fight in 5 easy lessons? Hahaha

    Please...look beyond the marketing.
  6. nekogami13

    nekogami13 Master of all I Survey

    You asked for opinion, I gave it.

    I agree with the do not go quietly,look at what happened with the girl abducted from the car wash(caught on video).She offered no resistance,just went off with her killer.
  7. abby

    abby New Member

    Most rapes aren't committed by a serial rapist. They are committed by a friend or acquaintance. It's hard to "fight back" when you drink gets drugged. (Speaking for unfortunate personal experience here.) The truth of the matter is that if someone you know rapes you, they probably aren't going to kill you or leave you for dead. They'll rely on the fact that they say "it was consentual".

    As far as the fighting part goes, I don't think (correction, change "i don't think" to "i know") 5 lessons are enough to teach someone self defence. I think the letter is a scare tactic to get people to take the class.
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2004
  8. STASH

    STASH New Member

    Ahem: "60% of rapes and most battering happen at home", "because 68% of rape victims knew their assailant, 28% are raped by husbands or boyfriends, 35% by acquaintances, 5% by other relatives"

    "The reason I was compelled to add this letter is because personal protection and martial arts (including Kickboxing) are not the same thing. There are too many people claiming to teach something they know not much about but market themselves accordingly."

    There's the point I was trying to bring out. Cough...cough...selective reading...cough.
  9. Adam

    Adam New Member

    I have to agree I'm afraid. Standard SD marketing which turns my guts at the way it tries to intimidate people into getting MA training.
  10. Ghost Frog

    Ghost Frog New Member

    The story does reflect what criminal psychologists say about attacks of this sort, that the perpetrator attempts to move the victim to a secondary location in order to commit a crime, and that this is the best time to attempt to get away. It also reiterate some useful points that have been discussed elsewhere about approaches to self defense training.

    However, I'm in agreement with the rest of you. I'm in favour of people trying to do something to make this less likely to happen, but I'm not in favour of shock tactics like this. I think it's counterproductive, and produces a huge amount of fear in many women, without really inspiring them to do anything about it.

    I also find it distasteful that someone publishes a fairly gratuituous description of a horrific murder in order to bolster their organisation.
  11. hkphooey

    hkphooey New Member

    "sales tactics......rapes aren't committed by serial rapist.....people really aren't in danger....what ever else"

    Not really concerned if they have that posted on their site as a sales tactic or not, women are beaten and raped every day. Violence happens around the world everyday. Weapons are not used in most rapes, they best tactic for the rapist is intimidation.

    Odds are, if you have raped once you will do it again and again until you are caught or have a pen stuck through your throat.
  12. David

    David Mostly AFK, these days

    Apathy? What can you do? ;)

    It's hard enough being responsible for yourself, let alone trying to do it for ppl who don't care.

    The apathetic are liabilities to the rest of us: they should be rounded-up and quarantined.

  13. Reiki

    Reiki Ki is everything!

    SD is something that u need to constantly work at, with the emphasis on WORK.

    I agree 5 lessons is not enough to learn SD properly however even if it gives a slight advantage to a woman where she realises that she can do something then its better than sticking your head in the sand.

    Isnt it better than someone trys to motivate women to get cracking and DO something rather than just say "it wont happen to me..."

    Even if I can help one person to not be a victim by fighting back when she can it is better than doing nothing IMHO.

    Shoot the apathetic! :woo:
  14. abby

    abby New Member

    Ok, let me rephrase what I said. It's a scare tactic to get women to take a course that will probably do them absolutly no good and give them a false sense of security.

    She may have confidence to fight back, but confidence only goes so far. It's better to try to avoid the situation alltogether. (As in the book "The Gift of Fear"). (and yes, I know avoidance isn't always possible.)

    I just think courses like this (not particularly this one, I didn't read the whole site) are going to get a woman killed over $50 in her purse. (Different situation when someone is trying to rape/murder you, but mugging is also common.)
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2004
  15. STASH

    STASH New Member

    Lol, this coming from a TKD student.

    I'm just glad you're not insulting the course itself since it did receive an extremly high rating and recommendation from the American Women Self Defence Association.

    I agree that the marketing is extreme however there's so much sh*t out there and sometimes it takes extreme marketing to get people to realize things.

    Now, I ask you all this question. Where did all this "5 lessons", "this course is useless", "it'll do them no good" bs come from? If you're going to comment about the course itself, do some research or better yet, TAKE IT, then comment.
  16. STASH

    STASH New Member

    Sorry abby, that may have been a little harsh. Lets just forget about it, if any of you actually experience the course or bother to do some research, then talk to me.
  17. nekogami13

    nekogami13 Master of all I Survey

    The point I and others are trying to make is this-taking a seminar is pointless.To develop self defense skills takes regular training over a long period of time, developing reflexes.

    The add slams kickboxing.You know what, I would rather spend my money sending my daughter to a kickboxing class(actual kickboxing,not cardio tae bo crap)and BJJ classes than a seminar. At least I would know she was developing the ability and reflexes to actualy fight,standing or ground.She would learn to strike with power, get use to being hit, and learn real effective ways to use the guard position(classic rape position) to escape the attack. She would also learn to be agressive when the situation called for it. After a couple years of this she would stand a chance in a confrontation-far more than what a seminar would do for her.
  18. KickChick

    KickChick Valued Member

    Unfortunately it is true that the average woman will not learn self defense until they or someone they know have either been attacked or have come close to being attacked or threatened, much the same way a homeowner installs an alarm after he is burglarized.

    I am not acquainted with the particulars of the self defense course that is offered at the particular school sited on that link ...
    The average woman wants to learn how to defend themselves but as with most everything nowadays,they want to be able to do it quickly and without too much effort.
    Ben Franklin said, "The used key is always bright". One needs to practice self-defense skills regularly. If you are serious about self defense you need to train as if your life depends on it, because it probably will.

    That is my opinion ... but then again I am not in denial or apathetic.

    Easy Stash, (yes a bit harsh you are)... maybe you can explain the course since you seem to be trying to sell it to us.
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2004
  19. Reiki

    Reiki Ki is everything!

    just what I said.....

    hey, good to see u made it here from fightingarts mate!
  20. STASH

    STASH New Member

    If you guys are interested in reviews of the rape prevention seminar check out the Senshido forum http://senshido.savi.ca/


    reviews/comments at the Geoff Thompson forum


    It happened a while ago so you'll probably have to check out the second or third pages. Good discussion guys.

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