Andy's leaving

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by Cooler, Jul 11, 2004.

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  1. Cooler

    Cooler Keepin The Peace Supporter

    Due to Andy’s standing on the site we have decided to put up the reasons for Andy’s leaving. This is so that people do not get the wrong impression of the whole thing.

    I started the site 3 years ago I then made Hongkongfuey a part owner in the site, as he is my closest friend and he has a great technical knowledge, which has been a great help to the site. When I was spending less and less time on the site HKF was having to deal with more and more so we came to the decision that we needed someone else to help him out. That someone was Yoda, he knew the site and he had the technical knowledge and after much persuasion he became an owner as well.

    This decision was not made on who was the longest serving member or the most popular it was to do with the practical element of who had the capabilities to help James out if the site went down or needed repair.

    Being an owner of the site gains you nothing but a headache as all problems eventually end up on your doorstep. An owner is responsible for making sure the hosting costs are paid and the site stays up and running. They make no money whatsoever. They do not make any changes on the site without discussing it with the Global Mods.

    HKF has been an owner on the site for about 2 years and Yoda ever since he got made up to Admin, which was a good while ago.

    The subject of ownership came up just recently in a discussion on the Global Mods forum and Andy took great offence to the fact that HKF and Yoda were part owners of the site and this had not been discussed with the other GMs. I might add here none of the other GMs had a problem with this. The reason ownership was not discussed is because it does not affect anyone apart from myself in anyway. The site runs the same way regardless of who owns it.

    This is the reason Andy felt he had to leave the site. Now right or wrong I made the decision of ownership off my own back and I made those decisions on what would be best for the site and make no apologies for that.

    I will stress again at no time was Andy asked to leave the site we all stated we didn't want him to go, his role within the site was not changed in anyway and the site was not going to go in a new direction which Andy opposed.

    I am not trying to belittle Andy in any way here I just feel it is important you all know why he left. He obviously had his reasons but we are still not sure what they are. And we really don’t know what the irreconcilable differences between him and the owners of MAP are.

    Andy was an important part of MAP and always will be. He will always be welcome here.

    Hope this answers any questions you might have please feel free to ask if there is something you don’t understand.
     
  2. JohnnyX

    JohnnyX Map Addict

    Many thanks for that update.

    I hope, in this case, that 'time is a great healer' and Andy sees things in a different light in the future.
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2004
  3. Andy Murray

    Andy Murray Sadly passed away. Rest In Peace.

    None of the above constitute the reasons for my departure!
     
  4. Cooler

    Cooler Keepin The Peace Supporter

    As stated above we can only speculate the reasons for his departure, as what I have published is the events which led up to Andy leaving. If Andy wishes to he can post his reasons for leaving clearing this whole matter up.
     
  5. Andy Murray

    Andy Murray Sadly passed away. Rest In Peace.

    Andy felt, and still does, that it is not in the best interests of MAP that he does post his reasons for leaving.
    Suffice to say Jack, that you are well off the money, and your interpretation of events is skewed.

    Doesn't seem like speculation to me.


    If I were you, I wouldn't attempt to blow smoke up MAP members asses.

    If you wanted to know reasons you could have responded to PM's, or used my email addresses and phone numbers which you have.

    Why not just let me leave with some dignity intact?

    You owe me that much at least surely?

    P.S. those trying to reach me can do so by roodolf@btinternet.com

    My PM box was downsized immediately after my resignation!
     
  6. Nrv4evr

    Nrv4evr New Member

    regardless of the reasons, andy, we're still going to miss you. :cry:
     
  7. Cooler

    Cooler Keepin The Peace Supporter

    No one here is trying to blow smoke up members asses as you so politely put it.

    As I said earlier you can post your reasons for leaving here and end the matter we have nothing to hide from the members. If we did want to blow smoke up the asses of the members we certainly would not put this post up knowing you would reply to it.

    I will not be pulled into an argument with you over this.

    We at MAP have made this subject public due to your statement in you goodbye post namely

    This gives the impression of us forcing you out, which is untrue. I’m one of those owners and have no clue what these differences are.

    This all started with the topic of ownership and all subsequent posts up to your leaving us were on this topic, leading us to believe this was your reason for leaving. As you never gave us a concise reason we had to take it that it was the ownership issue. Now if we are wrong please correct us and put the record straight because I for one would like to know the reason without all this cloak and dagger stuff.

    Again this post gives the impression there is something to hide which there is not.

    No one here is trying to stop you leaving with dignity but what I won’t have is people believing you to be some sort of victim of the owners of MAP.
     
  8. Andy Murray

    Andy Murray Sadly passed away. Rest In Peace.

    No, it doesn't, hence the use of the word 'resigning'.


    Just leave me alone Jack.

    If I was out to hurt MAP, I could have done so in many ways.

    Keep pushing this envelope though, and you'll do a great deal of damage to not only the forums spirit, but your own standing in it.

    Like I said, you have various channels of communication to me.
    Try using one of them, instead of engaging me in debate which seasoned members of this board would tell you, will get you nothing but an eggy complexion.

    I'd reccomend you take this thread off the forums main page, as it's poorly worded, poorly thought out and frankly a bad advert for MAP.

    Something I still care greatly about.
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2004
  9. Mrs Owt

    Mrs Owt New Member

    I should probably just stay out of this, that being said, I won't. Both MAP and Andy Murray are something and someone I think highly of. I would hope that this dispute can be settled between you for many reasons. Of course the well being of MAP is important but your own friendships, peace of mind and dignity are far more important.

    Please, I beg both (all) of you to seriously sit down and talk this through. I myself have been involved in issues which dealt in heresay, innuendo, rumour and wrong-doing on both sides. The hard feelings and damage it does to a person, their ability to trust and their faith in other people is immense. If you can possibly sort this out then do so. Please, if need be a mediator, or a disinterested party can help facilitate this.

    I personally know how difficult talking to someone who you don't trust, and who doesn't trust you can be. If you perceive harm or feel threatened it seems even more difficult. You were all once friends or at least had a similar dream, can you not go from there and try to put this to rest peacefully? Please, do not drag others into it - that is what begins to make it irreparable. I am begging you, not for MAP's sake- that is just a forum, but for your own well-being, please get together, talk this out like the mature, rational, intelligent adults you are. You built something wonderful together, thank eachother, respect eachother and move on.

    In my case I never got the peaceful resolution to a damaged relationship, far too many people, half-truths, lies and pig-headedness on both sides were involved. I know how long-lasting the ramifications can be and how unpleasant it is to have something that once gave you so much pleasure turned into something dark and painful. Please, take this dispute off of the forum, meet like gentlemen and resolve it.

    I know I am totally out of line here, but it tears me up to see MAP members being embittered and what was so lovingly built damaged.

    Feel free to kick me, I probably deserve it. I couldn't remain quiet and watch the damage done.

    Take care and peace.
    Candy
     
  10. Cooler

    Cooler Keepin The Peace Supporter

    This was never meant to be a debate Andy I posted a thread explaining the reasons we thought were responsible for your departure, you told us these reasons were wrong we have asked you to clarify those reasons so that no one gets the wrong impression. You have declined to post your reasons but instead hit out at us or rather me inparticular, for what reason I don’t know because I am not trying to get at you.

    As for taking this post down we will keep it were it is. You seem to forget you were and still are a popular member of the site, you hold the respect of a lot of members including myself. So I believe it is only right that we keep this thread open so those members can see what really happened and not have some wild speculations going on in there heads.

    If this is a bad advert for MAP then so be it but I believe the members would rather be informed than not.
     
  11. Jim

    Jim New Member

    Amazing that I'm in agreement with Candy here.

    I'd like to know ALL the reasons as I'm sure everyone else does and, more importantly, I'd like this to be fully resolved. Do a Mr Furious if need be and storm back in again.

    Alternately if it needs an independant mediator I'd like to offer my services at half the standard fee plus outgoings. ;)

    If anyone wants me I'll be in the corner kicking Candy.
     
  12. Andy Murray

    Andy Murray Sadly passed away. Rest In Peace.

    I replied, saying the reasons given are wrong. I declined to give those reasons, end of story. I wasn't hitting out at you other than you won't let it lie and play the pious, hard done by forum owner.

    That's against my best advice, but hey, it's your site.

    I forget nothing.

    What wild speculation is that?

    Put it to a vote then?

    Tell them all it's because I was caught practicing Stavit and be done with it.

    Just leave me be and move on please.
     
  13. Tika

    Tika New Member

    Im starting to feel like the poor child hiding in the corner watching her parents fight.
     
  14. Cooler

    Cooler Keepin The Peace Supporter

    Ok Andy this thread will be closed as I said I did not want this thread to turn into an argument, which it has.

    You have declined to give your reasons for leaving the forum, which is your right, but please don’t go giving it the 'irreconcilable differences between myself and the owners of MAP' approach, as none of the owners know what those differences are.

    As for the 'hard done by forum owner' I don't feel hard done by but obviously you do for some reason. I am saddened that it has come to this and wish you all the best in whatever you do.
     
  15. Bruce_Wee

    Bruce_Wee New Member

    we all have resentments toward our parents :D
    muhahahah :eek:
     
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