Adam Mizner?

Discussion in 'Tai chi' started by EmptyHandGuy, Apr 20, 2020.

  1. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    ^ the guy with wrestling / bjj experience seems to be the best!

    I'm not sure that's exactly the point you wanted to make, but here we are!
  2. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    I think the "politeness" part of it is important.
    When debating stuff online I will be blunt and matter of fact. Polite (I hope) but not averse to a bit of confrontation and being abrasive. But in person I'm much more polite and quietly spoken. I'm not someone to naturally challenge someone else, especially when it's not in "my" area.
    For example...I will gladly deconstruct and mock religious beliefs online, and with someone who knocks on MY door, but I'll sit in one of my kids assemblies or church services and quietly let the priest or headmaster get on with it.
    One time I was watching evangelicals spout nonsense from a soap box in town. I was talking to my wife about the rubbish being said and some of the "audience" overheard what I'd said and turned to challenge me on it. As it turns out the "audience" was largely made up of other evangelicals (part of a good confidence trick is the theatre and showmanship which can include "planting" people in the audience). Soon I had about 5 people round me and those 5 people got both barrels as they had challenged me. Up until that point I was just watching and quietly commenting.
    There's an old story about Karl Tanswell hopping over the barrier at SENI one year and embarrassing a cystema instructor trying to show knife defence. Not many people are like Karl Tanswell unless directly challenged.
    Especially in front of cameras, with an audience, etc.
    I've been in PLENTY of martial arts classes where some palpable nonsense has been said, opined or demonstrated and I've just nodded and smiled (while inwardly cringing and rejecting it).
    The power of social "oil", decorum and not making a scene is strong and it takes an outspoken individual to go against that.
    Bryan Shaw for example strikes me as a good ol' American boy. Probably uses "Sir" and "ma'am" with people all the time.
    I don't think someone like Eddie Hall would have gone along with it in the same way? He's a more "direct" individual.
    Werdum is a happy-go-lucky type of person just out to enjoy himself in life. Holder of one the most famous "troll" faces in MMA. :)
    Machida clearly still holds a lot of reverence and respect for the traditional martial arts. Probably because of his Dad and lineage.
    These are all factors IMHO.
    Flying Crane likes this.
  3. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Just as an example of tai chi working at standing grappling range, against high level grapplers.

    And an interview with a different internal Martial Arts guy who is widely known for being very skilled

    axelb and Grond like this.
  4. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    The key word Mizner used was "inanimate", that Qi is inside everything. That's not what I've read about Qi and I've been reading a lot lately.

    Qi means energy, movement of some kind. As far as I know anything about ancient Chinese physics, qi isn't used to describe dead, static things. Rocks don't have qi in Chinese history. And anybody claiming to have this magic finger force push power back in 1000BC China would have gotten their head chopped off. It's just not real, compared to a lot of other, good Tai Chi videos I've watched over the last few years.

    Mizner is trying make himself out to be a Tai Chi Jedi, to make a point that it's a special energy network, surrounding all living things, and we know the rest is all from Star Wars. Fake Morgan Freeman said the Chinese unlocked this mystery 3,000 years ago. It's more like prehistoric Man did.

    I can't help but watch that video over and over and see, in my head, Mizner getting the snot beat out of him by any one of those guys, inside or outside the ring. No fingertip Tai Chi magic would save him, in this universe.
  5. windwalker

    windwalker Member

    That he studies with Adam, found something in his work....not offered in what he did before..
  6. windwalker

    windwalker Member

    Have you never heard of gathering the "Qi" from heaven and Earth

    "Taoist practices also include methods for obtaining “solar and lunar Essences. Other methods range from absorbing the qi energy of mountains, trees, and lakes to metals and stone "
  7. windwalker

    windwalker Member

    a little more

    "Ancient Chinese Medicine noted that Man is between Heaven (universe) and Earth (our planet) – we’re interconnected to and thus affected by everything that surrounds us (no matter how large or small, near or far). If we drill down, we can see that this includes the land we call home including any natural environments left in our modern world.

    These places with natural waters, forests, animal habitats, etc. typically have much more Qi than the stark concrete buildings of cities where many of us work or within our homes where we live and sleep. When one’s Qi is deficient, Chinese Medicine teaches us to rest, practice Qi Gong and connect to nature to increase our Qi and improve our overall health."
  8. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Doesn't Feng Shui posit that qi flows through the universe? And if your lamp shade is in the wrong place it'll disrupt qi?
    I's all nonsense but I think the only thing we could all probably agree on is that if you asked 2 people what qi is you'd get 3 different answers.
    It's not like it's actually describing anything rooted in reality so definitions are free to wander about.
  9. windwalker

    windwalker Member

    Having lived in Asia, and China for quite some time I would say the reality is that it's quite consistent, supported by a large body of evidence from the cultures it originated from.
    Whether one ascribes to the theory or not a matter of choice...if something is judged wouldn't it be judged by what it itself is said to be based on... Isn't this part of critical thinking.
  10. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Well-Known Member

    I agree that there are a lot of social factors that go into this. However, when someone is trying to make a video to cast themselves in a positive light, and they ask others to be in that video to lend it credibility and could easily be interpreted as an endorsement, that is on a whole different level. From the snippets contained in that short promo video it’s does not appear that those fellows were simply there in the audience, being polite. They were active participants. Knowing that this video was being made, the polite thing to do is to step back and not participate. If you participate and allow yourself to be featured in a video, and you go along with what is being done, then you are giving it your endorsement.

    The possibility was raised earlier in this thread that perhaps these were video clips taken from a larger gathering of martial artists, and these fellows did not know it would be edited together into something that seems to feature them and create their endorsement. It is possible. But given what is seen in the short promo, I find it doubtful. It looks to me like they willingly came together to make this video. I could be wrong. Some additional background information would be useful. But it does not look like it to me. It looks like they willingly participated and gave an implied endorsement by taking part.

    i would be interested in seeing the finished product. Does anyone know if it is available?
  11. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    That's not how reality works though is it?
    You can't "choose" to ascribe to gravity, evolution by natural selection or the germ theory of disease. They are just a fact of the universe whether we like it or not.
    If I trip over I can't decide not to believe in gravity.
    If I drink some dirty water I can't decide not to get dysentery.
    Dead_pool likes this.
  12. windwalker

    windwalker Member


    do you believe in God,,,

    You do understand that gravity and other things we're not always believed to be the way things operated at different points in history.

    The reality, changed as peoples perceptions and ability to measure it improved.
    Chinese medicine has a history of thousands of years, with a large body of evidence supporting it.
    It is based on a different world view than Western medicine.

    The Mystery of Chi |

    this doctor has the right approach in trying to understand something that he does not..
  13. windwalker

    windwalker Member

    On this thread, there have been certain assertions concerning qi, as it relates to the culture from which the concept is from that are incorrect.
    They never seem to get addressed, the fact that they are wrong doesn't seem to be a problem.

    Just dismissed move on to the next point

    what is the point....?
  14. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Which one? It'd help if you narrowed it down a bit.*

    Yes. I've bolded the important part of that.
    Do you think our ability to measure and perceive things has improved over the last thousand years? The answer is yes.
    Are our theories better and more accurate today than a 100o years ago? Again the answer is yes.
    As a result older innacurate theories get replaced (sometimes wholesale) or improved and refined.

    As far as I understand it a lot of the popularity of TCM came about when Mao promoted it after he realised he couldn't provide the people with adequate proper health care.
    And that most of the evidence about the efficacy of TCM is badly done, flawed and serves more as propaganda than actual evidence that can be replicated and scrutinised.
    When properly studied it becomes no more convincing that placebo.
    Coupled with the absolute havoc TCM (and ideas like it) are playing on the flora and fauna of the natural world it's really a set of ideas that should have been dropped years ago.
    Hopefully it goes exctinct before the Rhinos and Tigers do but I'm not holding my breath.

    And as I eluded to in my previous post the particular world view an idea or opinion sprung from has no bearing on the truth of it.
    The real world doesn't care.
    In the west we had the idea of balancing the humours to cure disease. It was, and is, nonsense.
    Balancing the humours is no more effective than balancing chi. It just happens to be western woo rather than eastern.

    *Actually it doesn't matter which god...I don't believe in any of them.
    Dead_pool likes this.
  15. windwalker

    windwalker Member

    And there it is....The "real world"

    yep,,,might try to understand what part of the world makes up the biggest population for humankind.
    They might differ...
  16. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    He was hitting arm drags and back takes and valley drops, he apparently also teaches bjj did Adam teach him those?

    Apparently this is Ramzi training MMA here.

    Grond likes this.
  17. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    None of that validate the Mizner fake finger Qi magic video.

    Point being, Qi is a metaphor. It's not some fifth force of the universe. It's nothing the Chinese discovered, either. It's meaningless without context, so in THIS context, there's no Qi making Mizner's opposite move. It's movie magic nonsense, the way he's describing it and trying to SELL this short clip. It says "SALES" on the demo title.

    But you're a Tai Chi master? Then you should know better, so why aren't you addressing the elephant in the room, rather than the red herring of "universal Qi"? First 30 seconds, go for it.
    Last edited: May 19, 2022
  18. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    It's yet another blatant attempt to validate a real fighter through someone who can't or won't, because they interacted once.

    Some people throw down, others video themselves on a mountain and sell it.

    And I have nothing but RESPECT for Tai Chi. Just not this hooey.
    Last edited: May 19, 2022
    Dan Bian and Dead_pool like this.
  19. windwalker

    windwalker Member

    And yet he studies with Adam,,,

    guess according to some here he must have ulterior motive for doing so.

    Other then its something he feels is useful to his practice
  20. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    Where's the video of him lapdogging Adam Mizner's fake Tai Chi then?

    Maybe we should add a few new possible suckers to the list. That seems to be the community consensus. Whether they're unaware, paid shills, or something else, let's get it all out there.

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