Haha koyo you beat me too it... Many things like this are demonstrated so the audience can see what's going on. Kote hineri (forearm twist for us....the yoseikan boys call in yuki chigai and I think other Aikido terms place it as Sankyo) is a great example. As kansetsuwaza goes, I'm never going to hold someone with this lock....they just scuttle away from it and you have no choice but to snap their arm. It is however a great way of gaining control of someone and then changing to either a takedown or another lock. When we demonstrate it, we hold uke there to show off the correct angle, body position etc. Koyo hit the nail on the head as usual.....uke can and probably would pull his foot back but while he's doing that he'll get hammered by a following atemi. On a side note after doing Ju Jutsu for almost six years I've decided it's time I took up the Yoseikan Aikido that's also taught at the dojo - It's the same system more or less - all taisabaki and basic waza are the same - but the time I've spent training with kensei has improved my ju jutsu dramatically so I'm going to dive straight in! I'll let you know how I go
The thing about the toe demonstration (and Shioda Sensei's big toe is actually on top of the webbing area just above his uke's big toe), is that it is an example of chushu-ryoku - concentrated power. He may have only been about 100lbs (45Kgs), but if you rested a sharp object on top of your foot, and then put 45Kgs on that - and then added attitude - it goes way beyond a 'trick'. The feeling is actually that you are being pinned to the floor, and that what is pinning you is extending three floors down. It may be funny from Shioda Sensei's perspective, but it certainly isn't from uke's! Phantom: I realised that you weren't making the point that there was a sourcing of material from Shugyo to AWP, but as I mentioned my response is a reflection of my pedantry (on this particular subject) rather than your comments. Anyway, glad you liked the book. Dento: I'm glad that AWP inspired you to go to Iwama. I spent three months there in 1988 after I left the Yoshinkan Hombu, and had a great time there - and Saito Sensei went out of his way to talk about Shioda Sensei when I was in the class, and how he (Shioda) was his sempai, etc. One of the great things about MAP is it allows people to become aware of the history and traditions that our training has developed from, and I think that this sort of exchange can only enrich the reality of our daily training. Best regards to all, David
I also enjoyed reading Aikido Shugyo. Another related book, Aikido Jinsei, is partly available on Aikido Journal. Does anyone know whether the rest of the original Japanese text is likely to be translated in the future? Many thanks.
I really like Gozo Shioda. It is driving me nuts because I can't find my favorite video of him on youtube. He does this wrist grab technique where he shifts his weight ever so slightly and knocks this big guy down with ease. The funniest part is that he has one of his two demo partners try it on the other and he can't budge him. Practical or not, that technique shows that Gozo Shioda really understands balance. Very cool. Now if I can just find that damn video:cry:
I think you may be speaking of one of the "Friendship demos" from aiki journal. I remember the guy just standing there almost smiling until Shioda applies it. regards koyo
Did you intend to put a link? I haven't been able to find the video on youtube, it is driving me crazy.
That wasn't it. Although I like that one. The one I saw was not a joint lock. His partner seized his wrist and by a very small shift in position he forced his partner to fall. No countergrab at all. I know a similar technique but my movement is nowhere near as refined. I think Koyo was right in that it was a friendship video, but I just can't seem to find it again.
Yes and I will. I post back if I find it. Edit: Thanks Vimtoforblood, I found it. Dailymotion - Martial Arts- Aikido - Shioda - une vidéo Sports et Extrême The technique I am referring to is at 5:30. 2nd Edit: Click the heading to see the video, embedding didn't seem to work.
Have to say that from all of the footage I've seen over the years I've always thought that Shioda sensei looked the most like O Sensei in terms of his movements. I never really understood why *most* Yoshinkan Aikido always looks robotic, Shioda sensei's was anything but... I'm sure a Yoshinkan guy will jump in here. lol. But then I've trained with Amos Parker once and he was completely unlike anything I imagined he would have been! Such a nice guy, great aikido, nothing robotic . I'm guessing it's mostly looked robotic because it's only ever seminars I've done with Yoshinkan teachers and never a lesson. Could be wrong though! From the clip posted above I actually saw a lot of similarities with what I've seen and felt from Hiroshi Ikeda sensei from the balance breaking taking place. It's always good to see your perception of what this style and that style usually looks like broken .
I too have trainind with many shoshinkan aikidoka and found them to be respectfull effective aikidoka. As far as the "robotic" aikido goes. In most aikido clubs we begin training in technique/principles almost immediately. However I THINK in shoshinkan MUCH more emphasis is placed on kamae (posture) feeling that you must become powerfully balanced even before you begin training in technique. So while beginners in other schools may look a bit sloppy.. the beginner in yoshinkan can look robotic in comparison. Having trained with Dave Ruebens I can say that at a higher level the schools are almost identical (if trained properly) regards koyo
Absolutely I agree. I've always enjoyed training with them, I was on a course that Dave Ruebens taught a few years ago, I'd guess, 2001 or 2002 or so, loved his class! Both styles of teching and learning have benefit and I guess sometimes the one you prefer is the one you happened to come across before you even knew that different styles of aikido existed. A friend of mine was on a teaching course recently and was asked what style of aikido he did by an Iwama guy and a Shodokan guy because they both felt they did something similar to him, his answer was simply that he did aikido
WRT to the toe stepping thing, I've seen repeated references to the fact that shioda could do such "miraculous" things as seen in his demo's because he had gone back and trained trained in daito ryu after his time training with Ueshiba. I think it may have been Stan Pranin who first brought this up. Above quote taken from here: http://www.emptyflower.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=3167
I doubt it because O Sensei Ueshiba taught Shioda kanshi Daito Ryu even awarding him a certificate.Shioda kanshi went ON to create Yoshinkan.
So you go away for a couple of weeks, and when you come back people have said nice things about you....Thanks for that.... I understand why people might think that Yoshinkan looks robotic (even though it isn't - or at least, shouldn't be). However, at the risk of repeating myself, to understand Yoshinkan you have to realise that it was designed to be taught to rows of soldiers or policemen, which is why there is a lot of repetitive training in Yoshinkan, concentrating on small aspects of body mechanics such as the use of the ankles, knees, hips, pelvis, armpit, shoulder, elbow, wrist, fingers...etc. What is true is that Yoshinkan training is based upon the idea that in order to develop powerful techniques you first need to devlop a powerful, centred, balanced and above all stable body structure. Aikido is about control of your own body rather than the other person's body, and it is the focus on this one particular aspect of trainig that is the root of the power that Yoshinkan can develop. There are many other aspects - ki no nagere (flowing techniques), musubi (connection / integration), kokyu (breathing), etc which are equally valuable, but in Yoshinkan we believe that first of all comes correct posture, and only once that is established then all other aspects can be developed. I must say that I find myself increasingly frustrated when I see people who hold good (non-Dan) grades in aikido, and yet seem to have almost no consciousness of their own body, and how it should work within an aikido context. Off to training now, hope you all have a good weekend... David
