Discussion in 'Aikido' started by Big will aikido, Aug 28, 2016.

  1. Ero-Sennin

    Ero-Sennin Highly Skilled Peeper Supporter

    You and I are going to have a long talk one of these days. We'll both be wearing glasses and have our comfortable sitting cushions and laptops and we're going to go at it on how lifestyle habits, nutrition, and physical activity levels correlate with obesity just as much as genetics. Bring some good beer, and I'll bring plenty of caffinated beverages for me. We're just going to subscribe to 10 different online libraries with studies and go at it with references.
  2. philosoraptor

    philosoraptor carnivore in a top hat Supporter


    My thinking is that exercise habits and nutrition choice are informed by this weird hormonal flustered cluck that we've got going on and they're all symptoms of the same disease. It's not enough to say that someone isn't exercising and is eating garbage, there's the question of why are they doing that and other people aren't?
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2016
  3. Ero-Sennin

    Ero-Sennin Highly Skilled Peeper Supporter

    Same reason some people prefer to be active and do outdoor things, while others feel just as good in a cubicle or lab. I certainly believe in genetic disposition towards a certain way of life and a certain body type, but I also believe we have the awareness and ability to make changes to ourselves in order to circumvent the problems both our nature and nurture give us and become well balanced individuals both physically and mentally (include spiritually too if you want).

    Contrary to what my position seems to be, I also think that the current understanding of obesity and health is off the mark by quite a bit currently. I've been exposed (especially the last couple years) to physicians, psychiatrists, dietitians, personal trainers, and physical therapists and the disconnect on understanding how all the aspects of physical and mental health all work together is absolutely dumbfounding and astounding. When I had my initial appointments with my dietitian she wasn't too enthused about how I wasn't going to exercise to "get my heart rate up" because I did a physical job. She didn't think that increasing my physical activity by walking and measuring it through a pedometer was going to be enough.

    I dropped 60 lbs in 5 or 6 months and have hovered at the weight I'm currently at (around 245lbs) while I transitioned over to weight lifting. I definitely considered her dietary advice which helped tremendously, but when it came to weight loss through exercise and fitness she wouldn't ping on my top 100 radar of people to approach about it. Nevermind my physician who is morbidly obese who told me, "you have to get your heart rate up!" Like . . . . stop. I'll come to you when I have herpes or the flu.

    The biggest thing I've found through trial and error is that the current school of thought on obesity, nutrition, and fitness are all general guidelines but you have to really work on and pay attention to yourself and how YOUR body reacts, and you have to understand your limits which have genetic boundaries to them. I don't believe most of the general population is destined to have a certain type of body with no ability to change it if they want to, which seems to be what you're suggesting : P.
  4. Ero-Sennin

    Ero-Sennin Highly Skilled Peeper Supporter

    Initially my reaction was to ask if it was a one time comment or if they were saying something all the time to you. Context is important but it sounds more like the latter. It might be possible that they do want to see you better yourself and do not have malicious intent in their commentary, but are seriously lacking in their ability to empathize and approach the situation correctly. People get trained to do that sort of thing : P.

    In the end, do what makes you happy. Looks like you're going to do that, and good for you ^__^
  5. Latikos

    Latikos Valued Member

    So "good ego" :D
    Nothing wrong with that at all and as long as you can actually do everything that is asked up to the level that's needed, there shouldn't be a problem for your teachers.

    If you (or anyone who wants to get the next grading done) can't do what's asked - then there shouldn't be the next belt.

    When they're doing it for the sake of being mean - leave the place.

    In case you didn't do it already and sort of want to stay - try talking to them first.
    If they keep doing it - I'd leave.
    You don't have to take that sort of thing.

    Good luck with that and on your future way! :)

    Since I'm usually the weakest one during training, I really appreciate that thinking!

    I am rather lucky though: The more experienced people usually don't "go all strength" on my, but let me play a bit (then they usually tie me to a knot. But using technique mostly - my highest grade so far is only orange :eek: :D ).

    Once they use strength, there isn't much I can do.
    One of my teachers made a little fun two weeks ago: We were doing randori on the ground and he just lay on top of me.
    Nothing else.
    Until I tapped out.
    So yeah - people not only using strength, but technique and brain - awesome partners!

    In case you switch club, the next one should be lucky to get you.
  6. philosoraptor

    philosoraptor carnivore in a top hat Supporter

    Nah, I'm not trying to suggest that anyone is destined to be overweight, just that it's not as simple as "calories in - calories out" and that some people are going to have significantly greater difficulty in maintaining a certain weight due to environmental and genetic factors. It's not because someone is lazy or sloppy or stupid or any of the other negative stereotypes that we label people. So, yeah, can it be managed definitely, but I think looking at it as a disease/condition is more fruitful than saying it's a result of some personality flaw.
  7. Giovanni

    Giovanni nefarious editor Supporter

    i think this is kind of true for me. it's really hard for me to maintain a constant weight without supreme vigilance in what i eat. i've come to accept it at this point, but i try to be vigilant to keep the huge weight swings from happening. like i think i've gone from 220 to 190 and back about 10 times in my life--i'm 45. competing in bjj helps, because i don't want to roll against big guys. so i'm constantly fighting to keep it under 200, then drop down to 190 before a tournament so i can fight ibjjf medium heavy.

    pay attention to how you feel. i can tell you from experience, that doing physical things is easier if you're lighter. but if you feel alright doing what you do, and are not particularly interested in dropping weight--or it's very difficult because of genetic factors or life balance--and it's not particularly affecting your practice, then continue practicing your style and keep doing what you do.

    the only other thing to think about is obesity is a risk factor for a lot of diseases. this is what the science tells us.
  8. Morik

    Morik Valued Member

    Hi Big Will Aikido.

    I too am a large guy (nearly 300lbs).

    Several years ago I took Aikido.
    There were a few things that my size affected, but I think the instructor handled it very well.

    1) I am physically stronger than most guys who don't do regular strength training. When I'm doing regular strength training I'm stronger than most other guys period.
    At the time I was doing regular strength training.
    My partners would complain that I was too strong (e.g., some exercise where they try to hold my arm down and I'm supposed to get it up in a certain way without using too much muscle, but I can just bull through it).
    This made it a bit harder for me to pick up some of the subtler techniques: for people with less strength they just couldn't achieve the goal of the movement by brute forcing it, so they HAD to learn to do it correctly. This wasn't the case for me, and so I had to be careful to learn it the correct way.

    2) The instructor wasn't keen on me taking falls due to my size; was worried I'd injure myself. I only trained about 2-3 months with this school (I just couldn't make the class times work for me, it was too difficult to schedule around work). In that time I practiced break falls a lot but during all partner exercises I never took falls.

    3) I was not in good cardiovascular shape. The class wasn't that physically demanding, but just getting up so many times from practicing breakfalls or other techniques would gas me.

    Despite all this the instructor & students were all friendly, accommodating, and in my opinion did their best to help me learn & grow.

    I now train Jiu Jitsu. I'm still overweight. Its much more physically intense than the Aikido was. I often gas out in class during various drills (though I've been getting better with regular attendance).
    I do take falls and throws in this class and haven't had any injuries or issues from it. (I'm actually amazed at how much better my falling has gotten after just a few months. I used to feel jarring impact and couldn't get all the breakfall pieces lined up, now I barely feel any impact due to improved technique I believe.)

    This class is also very friendly. The instructor explicitly tells all students to take breaks whenever needed, take water whenever needed. No one calls you out for taking breaks.
    I had to take a TON of breaks during my first month. I'd apologize to whoever I was working with for the delay, and they would basically say not to apologize but to just take it at a pace appropriate for me.

    My weight is a hindrance to me, but I am advancing at the same pace as other students who started around when I did, and as far as I can tell am learning & applying the techniques as well as they are.

    I'd maybe find a friendlier school to train at.

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