Hi can anybody give me some information on master ang? He teaches hung kuen kung fu in the manchester area. I've read a lot of negative stuff about him. But there isnt any information as to why people dont like him. Also while im on the subject, anybody know of good kung fu classes in manchester? Im particulary interested in iron palm/leg/body training, All info greatly appreciated. Thank you
Sorry don't know anything about him but i would go along and give it a try, soon get the feel of whether the training is any good.
My friend Dave trained with Master Ang to 2nd Dan (or whatever the Kung Fu equivalent might be, I don't know, I'm a TKD guy). Dave says nothing but good things about his days with Master Ang. Alternatively you could train with Chris Boughey, head of North West Chinese Kickboxing (NWCKB), another reputable instructor in the Manchester area.
Hello there, My name is Giuseppe and I train directly under Master Ang and have done so for 2 years. I personally enjoy it and it's good fun. In our branch of Hung Kuen which stems from Wong Fei Hung and Lam Sai Wing you will start off as a white belt and go up the ranks until you get to black. Anyhoo forms training is a part of our style as with many Kung Fu styles out there. You will start off doing Tan Tui forms 1-12 along with their applications, you will then start to learn the 1 step sparrings which is introduced later on as you progress then there is the Sanshou applications (paired) which is also introduced in the later stages. When you achieve black belt status you will learn the individual animal forms which consist of the Fu (Tiger), Long (Dragon), Hok (Crane) Sieh (Snake) and Pao (Leopard) in addition to that you will also learn the 4 pillars of Hung Kuen. See other Hung Ga websites for more info. Training is varied and can be quite tiring so if you wish to attend a class make sure you bring a bottle of water and a small hand towel. But based on personal experience I enjoy the training and I get alot out of what i do. What ever you read on the internet is just politics so stay out of that. All you need to know is we study authentic Hung Kuen visit www.hungkuen-kungfu.com for more info. And hope to see you around. Ciao.
Just my 2 pence I have no connection with the club or the teacher. Heck, I'm not even in the same country! lol Just a few comments as per Bujinkan's post, as he's a direct student of the club "I personally enjoy it and it's good fun." That's very important. You have to like where you train. I feel the same way. "What ever you read on the internet is just politics so stay out of that." Although not everything on the internet is necessarily politics, I agree with you about staying out of the politics. They get in the way of learning & enjoying the art. "In our branch of Hung Kuen which stems from Wong Fei Hung and Lam Sai Wing you will start off as a white belt and go up the ranks until you get to black..." Like you, my branch of HG (a.k.a. HG = Hung Gar/Kuen, not HK in this post so as not to be confused with Hong Kong lol) also comes from WFH~LSW. However, the belt system (as seen in JMA & KMA) is not a part of traditional WFG~LSW HG. There's usually just a pecking order, where everybody just knows their place in the club, but belts aren't/weren't the norm. "...You will start off doing Tan Tui forms 1-12 along with their applications..." Tam Tui is usually found in northern CMA. Lam Sai Wing Hung Kuen is southern CMA. In the media, Dr. Yang Jwing Ming wrote a book on the 1-12. "...When you achieve black belt status you will learn the individual animal forms which consist of the Fu (Tiger), Long (Dragon), Hok (Crane) Sieh (Snake) and Pao (Leopard) in addition to that you will also learn the 4 pillars of Hung Kuen..." Hai ya, the belt thingo lol True, LSWHG includes the pillar sets. However, LSWHG does not include individual sets for each of the 5 animals. Other "village" HG might, as does Ha Say Fu HG via Wing Lam's videos. Hey, Wing Lam also has Tam Tui on video. "...All you need to know is we study authentic Hung Kuen..." How do you define "authentic Hung Kuen"? Your branch of Hung Kuen appears to have a mixed lineage, not just the WFH~LSW lineage. If it stems purely from WFH~LSW, then there would not be any Tam Tui forms or individual animal forms. However, it's possible that the sifu has cross-trained by having learned from other sifus (or media - tapes, books, DVDs, etc.) and incorporated other HG or other CMA (non-HG) into his curriculum. I don't care to look for the negative comments online about this particular sifu & club. No need to add to that fire! lol IMHO, the most important things are: 1) the todai are enjoying their classes; 2) the sifu should be offering legit, authentic HG. Sorry, banana boy, to not answer your OP properly. It's better to make a personal judgement based on your personal experience. So, like Taffyleigh had said, maybe just check it out for yourself with a bit of caution. Only then will you find out whether you feel it's for you as per Bujinkan's or Super Foot's referrals or end up agreeing with liokault that it isn't for you. Nonetheless, Happy New Year to you all! And all the best to you in your kung fu quest, banana boy
Hello Juego Todo, You are correct in the fact that Tan Tui is a Northern set and that Individual Animal forms are not normally if not ever found in the WFH/LSW lineage. My teacher was a student of Sifu Cheong Wing Kwang he was taught by Song Siu Po and His own Father in Hung Kuen, Song Siu Po was a student of LSW. In addition HK Sifu Cheong has an extensive knowledge in Northern sets one of them being Tan Tui. Personally i think the reason why Sifu Ang incorporated Tan Tui into his school is because this would serve as a basic knowledge of stance work, punching and kicking, timing and breathing. Thats my own reason so please dont quote me on this. And last but not least, I know what you're thinking "belts in Kung Fu WTF!!!" I think the reason he introduced a belt system is because it is more appealing and well marketed in the western world. Overall i do enjoy my training and find it a lot of fun. And I know that there are a lot of Hung Gar Kuen schools out there that stem from WFH/LSW some mainstream some not, but each family style within the WFH/LSW branch have different training methods possibly additional forms which makes our art so great and interesting.:hat:
This would imply that it is non existent in Hung Kuen or at the very least is deficient. I think you will find the vast majority (if not all) of Lam Sai Wing, Tang Fong and all other branches would STRONGLY disagree.
Hey Guys thanks for the info. So does master ang teach iron hand/body/leg kung fu? Or is this a totally different style altogether? Sorry for my dumb questions, but im completely new to this and desperately tring to find out as much as i can. Happy new year to everybody.
I only ever heard bad things about Master Ang and I wasn't impressed looking at his schools website a while back. Sorry.
Hello Bananaboy. Your best bet is to actually go down and check out a class and see what YOU think. Our school is from the WFH/LSW branch and Master Ang was taught by a Sifu Cheong Wing Kwang if you are farmiliar with Wong Kiew Kit (Most people on this board are) he is personally acquainted with Sifu Cheong. Check out this link which will explain a little more about Sifu Cheong http://wongkk.com/answers/ans01b/jul01-2.html
It's not unheard of for some teachers of southern CMAs to start people w/Tam Tui sets.Simpler basic lines to practice before going on to more complex forms. Some of the additional sets Lam added were northern by origin,albeit executed w/southern flavor.(My teacher threw them away). I don't think it's a cause for concern if Tam Tui or individual animal forms are taught.Can be confusing as regards lineage claims if it's not clarified that some things taught are not themselves part of a particular system's teachings,but that's about it. Not quite clear on Bujinkan's post.The way it could be read is that after one receives BB in Tam Tui,one then receives instruction in Hung-animals,pillar sets.Correct,or no?
Thats pretty much correct when you grade for BB you will still need to perform the 12 road tan tui then the single animal forms come in for 1st degree, you would do the dragon form first out of the individual animal forms along with the application and then move on to tiger and its application (this is all for your 1st degree) then there are weapons forms like staff and then one sharp weapon form e.g broad sword, butterfly knifes, kwandao, etc, etc along with sanshou applications and 1 step sparring. The 4 pillars do come into play in the later stages however you can learn them for competitions (not gradings) one of the chaps who i train with has just finished off learning Fu Hok Kuen.
Hi I did hung kuen with master Ang's group for a while and was not that impressed. That said go and see if you enjoy it but whilst you are at it go and see some other classes. You are welcome at mine: http://www.manchesterdragons.co.uk/ , there is a wushu class on a Wednesday at Sunshine Studios which sounds good (not mine), Chris Bougheys lot who have already been mentioned http://www.btinternet.com/~lau2dgar/index.html . There is also a school which sounds like it specialises in iron body which is a Splashing Hands school http://www.manchesterkungfu.com/splashinghands/theschool.html Go take a look, ask lots of questions and if you have a friend whom is an experienced MAist take them with you.
While I agree for the most part about beginner forms being taught before the pillars in regards to building a foundation. I still haven't seen much from the Ang school the pillars shown themselves. Question to Bunjinkan83, have you seen master Ang demo the pillars or teach the pillars to any students? Also in what order are the pillars taught in your school? It seems that your malaysian lineage is slightly different than most LSW derived schools.
Thanks,Buji! It does seems odd to advertise as offering Hung instruction when one doesn't begin to actually touch on that curriculum for two and a half years or so.Assuming,since I don't know,that your average time pre BB test is 3 years at least.Or is it the new Korean initiated ranking system of 1st degree after 2 years? (Roughly equivalent of purple belt in the older ranking system).Either way,seems like a while before actual Hung instruction happens.Teachers teach what they wish.That's fine.Just think the advertising should be up front about this.
In answer to Bandwitshaw's question I have seen him teach the Tiger Crane but not the others, however one of his senior students has mentioned that the 4 pillars are taught in our school however unfortunately I do not know in which order they are taught sorry. In answering El Medico's question I think it does take roughly 2 1/2 to 3 years to attain your BB. In which traditional grading format they follow I do not know also. The Colours are in this order. White (Automatic) 1st Yellow 2nd Yellow 1st Green 2nd Green 1st Blue 2nd Blue 1st Brown 2nd Brown. 1st Degree BB and so on. Between each coloured belt grading, gradings are held every 3 months. However some students that do get to 2nd Brown wait for a year at least until they know the material to attain BB has been practiced and mastered correctly like one of my good friends and class mates, that is what he done. Hope this helps slightly, again if i was unable to answer particular questions then I do apologies.
I trained in Master Ang's club for between 3 and 4 years. For about 2 years Master Ang taught the class I joined. The lessons, especially those not taught by Master Ang, were haphazard with no continuity, no urgency, and were more like a social club with very little useful training going on. Gradings were a joke; people turned up not really knowing what they were supposed to do for their grading. It wasn't because they were lazy and hadn't learnt the stuff, it was because they hadn't been given the time and direction they needed AND they were told they were ready. There was no quality control; if you paid, even if you got most things wrong, you got the grade. All I had 'learned' after 3 years (AND A LOT OF EXPENSE) were some incorrect tan tui forms with some questionable applications. The fundamental techniques (stances, kicking, punches) were not correctly taught (there is more to a front kick than swinging your leg in the air!) and were rarely 'drilled'. The 'warm up' for each lesson was lax and consisted mainly of static stretches. Give the club a try out if you must but I implore you to be objective; keep in mind the things I have mentioned above and don't let your common sense get clouded due to misplaced loyalty or feeling of belonging. For example, if you attend one of the competitions you will witness many people dress up in full protective gear (body armour, head gear, shin guards...) and then try and inflict damage upon each other with their... toes. Ask yourself why someone doesn't demonstrate a more effective kicking technique. Someone posted a link to Wong Kiew Kit's web site earlier. Think twice and read this http://wongkk.com/general/recovery.html before taking that guy seriously. Did you know that you can cure yourself of cancer by practicing Qigong for three months? I'll leave you with this: http://www.hungkuen-leeds.co.uk/videoforms.htm Look at the quality of the stances! Kai performs the previously unknown 10 Twinkling Toes Fairy Form.
