How do you teach Krav maga without it becoming a complete disaster?

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by Vinny Lugo, Oct 30, 2016.

  1. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    Here's a very good starting point.

    Just because you have been stabbed doesn't mean you are going to bleed out.

    Go for the softener and you give yourself a fighting chance.

    [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ahn8oLQgbLI"]Defense against a rapid thrust knife attack - YouTube[/ame]
     
  2. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    Yeah, I made that mistake last sparring class. I tried to reset after getting stabbed. I figured- I lost and was dead. My partner kept coming at me and was like "don't stop! Don't give up! What are you doing?"

    I was trying to visualize how deadly getting stabbed was. But she was right. I needed to train to keep going until I actually drop. Maybe that stab wasn't in a critical enough place to drop me immediately.
     
  3. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    I got the video shot and will try and edit and upload it tomorrow.
     
  4. Morik

    Morik Well-Known Member Supporter MAP 2017 Gold Award

    I saw this a couple months ago:
    http://shtfschool.com/violence/guest-post-myth-busting-knife-attacks/

    Ignore the chart at the very start of the article (the article is about how wrong the chart is).
    Go down to the "Real Numbers" section.

    If that article is accurate, you can survive quite a while despite sustaining knife wounds.

    I.e., its not seconds. Its multiple minutes (10s of minutes sometimes) before you are unconscious/incapacitated. I'm sure you'd be slowing down in terms of strength & reaction times though.

    Also note that those numbers are for when a vein or an artery is hit. If you were stabbed or sliced somewhere that isn't a vein/artery, I imagine the times would be significantly longer before unconsciousness.

    But yeah, it sounds like even if you get stuck a couple of times you'd still have time to try to fight the attacker off and get a call in to EMTs.
    (I still don't like those odds at all, but its better than "they hit me once, I go down and die".)
     
  5. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    I think you need to Divide mindsets down a little more,

    A) Prefight - knifes can and will kill me, and even if they dont kill me, they will really really change my life and give me life long crippling injuries - so I should avoid fights if at all possible.
    b) During fight - I need to get this finished asap, and monitor hands etc as I go

    c) In training, whilst keeping realistic, I need to keep going during sparring/ knife drills
    as ''Its not the First knife hit thats kills me, its the last one.''
     
  6. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Burton Richardson showing performance under pressure -

    [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WjSTIcE0cE"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WjSTIcE0cE[/ame]
     
  7. philosoraptor

    philosoraptor carnivore in a top hat Supporter

    @Hannibal - I've always thought that was one of the best videos for knife defense.
     
  8. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    Well, that is a nice reinforcement of my training. What Sifu had us doing was very similar to Hannibal's clip. No shock knife though.

    We practiced the high block on the shoulder with one hand and the other lower near the wrist - except the lower one was a softer block- Poon Kiu style - if we couldn't grab right away. The block was more inside to outside then straight down to keep the blade away from the body. Then slide down into the double grab and moving in similar to that clip. I would say we tried to stick closer in overall too, but that just might be because the guy holding the knife in that clip is good at trying to keep distance.

    We practiced several disarms from that position. Waiting for the attacker's momentum. If he moved forward with a lot of momemtum, bringing him to the ground, but trying to stay up a little higher and stepping on the blade while maintaining the double handed grab. (I had trouble with getting low, but stepping with my knee issues. Others did just fine though.)

    If the opponent stepped back, there was a way to use a loosening one could feel with the step back to use the opponents blade by swinging it behind his leg and cutting him on the back of the leg and using the leg to knock the blade out.

    There was a more advanced thing he showed us a way of stepping in and around so your back was against the opponent and swinging the arm over your shoulder. raising up and using the shoulder to jointlock the opponent. I had pretty good success with that one. Although getting in close enough took a little practice.

    I have to say that my moving step TCC training was very helpful in this practice - feeling the opponent's momentum/ energy to figure out which disarm was the best and the way to move in close.
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2016
  9. Vinny Lugo

    Vinny Lugo Valued Member

    But what if they shoot you at the end because you are a witness to an armed robbery?

    But in the USA, everyone packs heat. So the chances are very high of being mugged here. So gun disarms would really be a nice thing to learn.
     
  10. Vinny Lugo

    Vinny Lugo Valued Member

    No but I have actually talked to Krav guys. They will tell you things like we don't actually spar because Krav Maga is all about surprise attacking the opponent. If you actually spar then it is no longer Krav Maga, but it becomes MMA.

    Good video

    An even better video.

    Please go into further detail on point C. I am confused.
     
  11. Vinny Lugo

    Vinny Lugo Valued Member

  12. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Well that's clearly nonsense.
    Surprise attacking the opponent is called a pre-emptive strike. A perfectly valid approach if you legally think you are in imminent danger of harm or trying to prevent a crime. UK law allows for such actions and, I assume, so do many other countries.
    But if Krav is all about surprise attacking the opponent why do they teach so many blocks? A block is a reactive action that is used when YOU are surprised attacked. Krav's very own training shows that it's not just about surprise attacking the opponent.

    And...if you surprise attack your opponent (not something you can rely on all the time)...and you fail...it's blocked, absorbed or misses then you are now FIGHTING.
    And fighting can be broken down and drilled with progressive resistance in sparring type drills.
    Sparring doesn't have to be structured with two people standing 5 foot apart on equal terms and with equal goals.
     
  13. Vinny Lugo

    Vinny Lugo Valued Member

    The guy that told me that was teaching commando krav. I'm not sure how that differs from regular Krav.
     
  14. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    There's more camo trousers and combat boots.
     
  15. Vinny Lugo

    Vinny Lugo Valued Member

    That's it?
     
  16. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    It was a joke man.
    Krav is as fractured and political as any martial art. Commando krav is just branding I think.
     
  17. greg1075

    greg1075 Valued Member

    A less forgiving version of the "lipstick and white t-shirts" version I used to do in jjj. The 2 on 1 has always been my go-to control. Has +s and -s.
     
  18. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    As promised here is the video from last night's class.

    A few points before you pass comment.

    Andy and I both have wrist injuries, so immediate and harsh wrist cranks are out of the question.

    No safety equipment, so headbutts and eye pokes are a no go.

    The focus on this video was control of the person and therefore the blade.

    My job with the blade was to stab Andy. I took the mind set of wanting to stick the knife in him, so no knees to the thigh for example to upset his balance.

    As soon as he had me I just wanted to get the knife back so I could stab him.

    The knife used was Nok knife.

    You'll see at the start of the video we use the head control shown by Ron Balicki, but we always add a forearm to the collar bone or chest and as you can see it took the wind out of my sails somewhat. At full power this would definitely made defending harder.

    I defend first to explain what is happening, then attack at almost full speed and about three quarter power.

    http://noktrainingknives.webs.com/apps/photos/photo?photoid=48903572

    [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baYm43a0q68"]Knife defence - YouTube[/ame]
     

Share This Page