Aikido Techniques

Discussion in 'Aikido' started by 0gmios, Jun 17, 2007.

  1. 0gmios

    0gmios Valued Member

    Now that is literally sensen on sen :D
     
  2. piratebrido

    piratebrido internet tough guy

    The Sasae Tsuri-Komi Ashi was the one I was pleased with. Though I do have a great big bruise on my elbow from when you planted me after catching that first kick.

    Man I love the Sunday session.
     
  3. Polar Bear

    Polar Bear Moved on

    That was a topper, I ate floor big time. The thing that amazed me was I keep my kicks low and you still manged to pick one off.
    Yeah I have a really sore jaw where colin sneaked past my guard and rattled me one.
    The Sunday Session is the best.

    The Bear.
     
  4. Rebel Wado

    Rebel Wado Valued Member

    My past martial arts experience with knives tended to be technique based rather than principles based. Some years ago, this totally reversed for me, now I care more about principles than techniques. It is the principles that make the techniques work. Technique work is important for many reasons, but it is the principles that come first.

    I've found I've gotten fairly "lazy" over the years when it comes to many things. I just like to keep things very simple. If I want to get somewhere faster, I run. If I want to close the distance I'll move forward as they move forward. In fact, unless I need to move otherwise, I just maintain constant forward momentum, even if I'm only moving inches at a time.

    The principle of minimum movement and maintaining maximum mobility seems to have impacted my way of thinking and acting... thanks Koyo :love:

    I also have simplified some principles to just basic strategies. Do not get hit is one of my favorites, but to simplify this I generally try to keep control of distance and stay shoulder to shoulder, or my shoulder to their chest. Protect/control the centerline, I have simplified to keep elbows down, keep back of forearms "towards" the blade, and always protect the high and the low line. These strategies are just basic interpretations of the much more dynamic and effective principles.

    You might notice something like when in a clinch one often goes chest to chest, which would go against one of my basic strategies which is to stay shoulder to chest or shoulder to shoulder. So I drill the clinch and from there I train to move to a better position for me.

    Another principle after do not get hit, is basically to control the delivery system of the enemy (take away their ability to attack effectively) which can get very complex when we talk about applying technique. The simple and quickest way to control the enemy is stun/unbalance AND knock them out/down. No fancy techniques... basically, do not get hit... AND knock them out!!!

    Another issue is that of TIMING. Too many techniques depend on excellent timing. Well frankly, this is overly complex because timing is one of the first things to go in a stressful situation and it is one of the things that takes the longest to develop because it is only developed through experience, awareness, and natural talent. The very foundation of technique, the basics, needs to be independent of timing (e.g. it needs to work without timing). From that foundation, then having good timing can improve things, but the bottom line is that you still got to have something that works without timing to fall back on... the basics.

    Besides multiple attacker, I have three drills I shamelessly stole from other instructors, that I like to work with knife training. These drills can be a measure of all techniques should you want to think at the level of "techniques."

    1. At 50% speed, uke comes at you with training knife with arm extended but not locked. As soon as you make contact, uke can resist by retracting arm, stabbing, twirling the wrist, AND slapping you with their other hand or kicking you or any other attack or defense they want. Start out at 50% speed (you can speed it up later) because at this speed, your technique has to be good since you cannot use speed/momentum or strength to compensate for bad technique. Try this against an uke twice your size and see what you can get to work and what is just crap to try.

    2. Second drill is to have uke with one foot and a hip attached to a wall. Uke has a training knife and can do what they want but they always have to keep one hip and foot against a wall. Tori enters, trying not to be hit and gain a superior position on uke. This is a very difficult drill against a "long knife" (e.g. short sword).

    3. Wear protective padding and eye protection, use chalk as a knife(s) (we wear black gi) and go at it. See where the marks are afterwards. Marks on the back of the forearm aren't as bad, but marks on the inside of the forearms, or on the throat, under the armpit, inside of the legs, groin, heart, etc. are not good.


    Sorry for the long post, but I had a lot to say I suppose.

    P.S. always wear eye protection on these drills if possible... safety first.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2007
  5. 0gmios

    0gmios Valued Member

    I use whiteboard markers.
    One time at university, I was telling a friend he should come to Aikido (you gotta recruit :D ). Anyway, he said it was no good, and I had a whiteboard marker, which he did not know about, we were messing about, and later he was a smart **** to me, so I told him to go to the bathroom. He said why, so I just told him to go again, it was only next door. So he did, and when he looked in the mirror he saw this line across his neck. He even came and trained for a while. This is how I found out that they would be great training tools :D
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2007
  6. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    Bottom line for me is the ability and spirit to go from zero to 100% attack in an instant.

    FUNNY (I THINK) story.

    I was doing a demonstration against a knife in the Kelvin Hall Arena in Glasgow. I was facing George Girven a really spirited aikidoka who was attacking with a real knife. Suddenly some idiot thought it would add effect to the demo if he turned on strobe lighting. In an instant all sense of timing and distancing were distorted. Thankfully Geo was confuse for an instant. Long enough for me to charge him slap the knife aside and sweep his legs from under him.I took him to the floor and strangled him out while he was fighting like a madman wondering what the hell was happening. The knife had gone flying out of his hand. The lady who was giving a comentary up to that moment in polite english suddenly cried in a broad Scottish accent Oh my F...... WE heard it echo around the hall . By then Geo and I were grinning like monkeys. Then we decide to find the "special effects" man and KILL HIM.WE did not find him.

    regards koyo

    sadly George died very young and Scotland lost one of it's finest martial artists.
     
  7. Rebel Wado

    Rebel Wado Valued Member

    That's some story Koyo.

    You are not the first nor the last to make such statements. :)

    Real world is zero to full throttle in an instant. So easy to forget things like this in training. A lot, I don't know how many, but a lot of martial artists tend to come into an engagement at "half-speed" thinking it is something like a sparring match (e.g. have a frame of mind that things are set at a certain speed and intensity). They are often caught off guard when the opponent goes from zero to 100% in an instant, and overwhelms them.

    P.S. sorry to hear about George.
     
  8. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    Since ALL of our techniques are applied as though the attacker is armed we do not concentrate on "taking" the knife. Best to attack the opponent "as a whole" taking any and every opening that is there. The proper attitude to empty hand attacks is that you must not be touched even slightly as ,if a weapon is invoved, you shall be cut.

    Therefor our manner of movement shall ensure that we are always off the line of attack. A pragmatic technique is executed and the attacker pinned. Then and only then shall we "take" the knife.

    below the attacker's arm had been locked by my knee AFTER he had been struck and thrown.NOW I may disarm him.

    regards koyo
     

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  9. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    Fundamental to all martial arts is budo damashi warrior spirit. The courage and INTENT to enter into conflict.This is not a contradiction of aikido philosophy (as some would have it)
    Since the art is based on sword principles the ability to explode into action when under stress is a fundamental principle. This is most important when facing a weapon.

    Below you can see the expolosive entry triangularly "into" the maai of the attacker.Aiki ken teaches this attitude. The body alignment escapes from the cut while the sword continues to "cover the centreline" This is a most potent practice when dealing unarmed against a knife.


    regards koyo
     

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  10. Aikidojomofo

    Aikidojomofo Valued Member

    Suwari Waza Ryote Mochi Kokyu Ho Ichi/Ni

    So, we were doing a LOT of Suwari Waza at the weekend and one of the main techniques we touched on was Ryote Mochi Kokyu Ho

    When I first attempeted this technique 7 months ago I had no clue as to how to move around on my knees and it's taken me a while to get used to it. Having said that I'm now a the point where my confidence with Suwari Waza is growing and Kokyu Ho is a technique I can probably do the best (though that's not saying much)

    Now, I'm quite good at lowering my balance and getting Uke to the tipping point of their balance with quite little effort, however, my problem lies with once their balance has gone and they begin to fall. I follow up and pounce on them as fast as I can making sure they hit the deck, but I don't seem to be able to move my knees at the same time towards the Uke. It's always one leg at a time (which puts me at an angle to Uke). When I try to move both knees at the same time I feel like I am pulling on Uke's arms, leaning forward and losing my balance. in fact on Sunday as I came in towards uke he saw I was off balance as I tried to move forward and took me right over him.

    Any tips on how to execute this technique any better? Or any tips on better movement with Suwari Waza techniques?


    *I should just like to note that I attempted to find a decent video showing the thechnique and it dawned on me that the Yoshinkan version seems to be quite different to that of Aikikai or Tradition Aikido, but any help would be appreciated

    Cheers
     
  11. embra

    embra Valued Member

    Simple answer:- lots of training. It comes but with effort and perseverance. Learning to open up your hips in suwariwaza is important.

    Suwariwaza is hard going on the knees, but you dont have to so far to go to ground in ukemi, so you can also regulate your breathing a bit better than in tachiwaza (standing.)

    There isnt any need to 'pounce' - just have a good kokyo in your arms projecting out from your body by breathing efficiently , deeply and calmly; and then follow through with your knees, making sure you keep your opponent within the control of your kokyo.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2010
  12. Aikidojomofo

    Aikidojomofo Valued Member

    Well, it's been 6 months and you were right. Effort and perserverence seems to have worked in over coming my problems with the technique

    I'm a lot faster on my knees now and can move with uke's fall to the mat, maintaining my posture and keeping them down.

    I'm a bit heavy handed with the technique though. I saw Takeno Sensei doing the technique in Japan and the power with which Uke hits the ground is astonishing. I have obviously tried to emulate him but it comes off as just trying to muscle on the technique...trying to run before I can walk, no doubt.

    I shall perservere further
     
  13. embra

    embra Valued Member

    Glad to hear that the perseverence is paying off. Your Aikido is Yoshinkan, mines is principally Aikikai and laterally some Iwama, so some things will be slightly different - but ultimately its just Aikido, regardless of 'style'.

    I wont advise too much, as I am not practising much Aikido at this moment and Im too busy (I am travelling a lot for work) to post much on MAP.

    However some further 'tips'. Kokyo-ho is really important in developing Awase (blending), alongside timing, rythym and distance (as koyo reminds us off from time to time); always maintaing contact - without stiffness and always with projection that does not open you up along your centreline.

    Developing good spirited kokyo is very, very important in Tachiwaza as well as in Sumariwaza. There is a quote somewhere from Ueshiba, somewhere along the lines of "at its highest level Aikido is kokyo" - so you have to keep on developing kokyo all the time - just like you discovered it the 1st time. From this you can learn really good posture with projecction.

    As ukemi in kokyo-ho, you should still develop kokyo - sometimes you can temper and regulate the flow of attack with goog kokyo as uke - sometimes.

    Suwariwaza is really important in learning to open up the hips and to combine that on your knees, and to translate that to tachiwaza. This all develops Taisabaki - explosive hip movement. Koyo talks about this in some of his posts.

    I would describe kokyo as something like good wine. The more kokyo develops - like a good wine matures, the more its quality becomes apparrent.

    These are just my perceptions, which does not make them gospel.
     

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