I've been looking around Youtube at some clips of CKD, and I'm somewhat concerned at how little intensity the majority of videos seem to show when the self defence techniques are being trained. I've found a couple of videos in particular and I would really like to know if this is representative of the style. Now, I should mention that I trained in CKD for about 6 months and was fairly unimpressed with both the defence drills and the close range defences that were taught, in some cases with the techniques themselves and in all cases with the way that students actually trained the techniques. I was hoping that someone from elsewhere in the style might comment on whether this is the case all over, because it really doesn't mesh with the claims of being "the most effective fighting system in the world". In this first video the self defence demonstration is at 1.35: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILt82RgLU1Q"]YouTube - Self Defense with Choi Kwang Do, Part 1[/ame] In this second, the black belt grading students demonstrate their close range techniques from about 2.25: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7HQNJXOmuUg"]YouTube - .[/ame] Now, in both of these videos the students are of black belt standard, which worries me quite a lot. The attacks are done with no intensity at all, there's no effort to make life difficult for the defender and as a consequence the defender occasionally stands there in the attacker's grip for several seconds before bothering to defend himself. I'm all for self defence training, but you need to train with a lot more intensity than what's shown in the videos here. So, is this the norm, or do the instructors/students here on MAP train harder than this? NB: I'm writing an article on CKD and its claim to be the most effective fighting system in the world, so it would be great if anyone could provide any real evidence to support this claim.
I honestly didn't hold out particularly high hopes of finding anything else, but I thought it only fair to invite students and instructors of the art to comment before I post my article.
If this was about Ninjutsu in the Ninjutsu forum we'd be on page 96 by now and everyone would be calling you a troll! :evil:
In fairness, these criticisms could be levelled at many MA schools. It's just poor training full stop. So much has been written about the "reality gap" between MA training and self-defence, e.g. see Geoff Thompson's books (notably Dead or Alive) and Peter Consterdine's Streetwise: www.amazon.co.uk/Dead-Alive-Self-Pr...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1251390729&sr=1-1 www.amazon.co.uk/Streetwise-Complet...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1251390697&sr=1-1 In my experience, very few schools teach the full repertoire of skills required for self-defence. That's not to say they don't teach some skills or great value.
The difficulty I have here is that it's a widespread problem apparently affecting most (if not all) CKD schools, and also that they claim to be the ultimate martial art while not testing that claim in any meaningful way at all.
Without mentioning names, we had a couple of CKD Black Belt Instructors come to our school and they could not cope with the directness, speed, power, fluidity etc. Ultimate Martial Art - Not for me.
Again it is someone with no actual experience making assumptions. If those girls kicked a guy in the groin ..."He will let go!!???"...he will tear their heads off!! Absolutely no basis in reality.
I don't like to get involved in badmouthing other MA's as I'm sure that the right MA works for the right type of person. But, a colleague of mine has been doing ckd for a short while and I asked her about the belt system and she said she 'will' be black belt in less than 2 years. This got alarm bells ringing as even if you go every day, surely you can't get the level of instinctiveness, aggression, timing and technique to such a supposed high standard in such a short time. What I will say though, is that if doing ckd gives someone enjoyment while they are there, and means that they will do something rather than freeze up if they get into a tricky situation, then it has to be worth it for that person.
The impression that I got from my short time involved with this art was that you'd basically get to black belt in the minimum timeframe if you turned up to class once or twice a week and your cheques cleared. I have not been impressed with the minimum standard for any grade within the art, and it seems that they're more keen on building self esteem by passing people for gradings every 2 months than on actually testing fighting ability. I'm sure there are good CKD black belts out there, but you certainly don't seem to need to be good to get that black belt.
Like we've said before there are good and bad schools in every art. There is one chain here in Milwaukee that the GM claims to be undefeated in over 250 'fights' in competition and they stopped letting him compete because he was too 'overwhelming' against others. He also claims he was so good he got his blackbelt in six months. Another second dan in our area challenged him and he refused saying it was 'beneath' him to hurt another TKD blackbelt. I think the same as in CKD. I've seen a former 'world champion' in BJJ get his head handed to him by a blue belt 19 year old in a local tournament, a karate master throw a tantrum at the Arnolds because his student has never lost a contest and so he obviously was 'cheated'.....you see it in all arts. There is no perfect or best art. Its what works for you. I can't punch worth crap but I can kick you into next week, someone else may be just the opposite. I hate it when people come on here and rant about this art or that art being so bad or making some stupid claim......
It's actually very hard for me to write this, having studied it for a long time, with an excellent instructor, in the past but the majority of CKD places I have seen are not very good at all. The system itself is as good as any other martial art, and the best instructors out there make sure that the intensity in training, and all the skills come through. Unfortunately I met very, very few such instructors towards the end of my time in the art. But in defense of CKD, if you do have a good instructor, and do train hard then it does work - same as any other.
At the moment I'm concentrating mainly on general fitness - lots of cycling, fencing and a bit of weapons (archery, longsword, shortspear, longspear, axe) practice now and then. I will get back into another martial art eventually, but I've looked around at a few of the local schools and none of them have really been offering what I'm looking for. But yep, I'm back.
